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I have 2 10 week old Border Terrier pups, one ***** and one dog, since they have been with me they engage in quite aggressive fighting i.e. baring teeth and going for the face as well as the body. Although I became aware of the problem with the bond between two puppies from the same litter which requires effort to overcome i.e. separate walks, training etc I was not expecting the aggression. Obviously I separate them when they fight and tell them 'no' they generally take no notice. The ***** is the main aggressor and, if things, don't improve, I will have to seriously consider taking her back to the breeder.
As a background they were raised (up until 8 weeks) in a family home (litter of 7) with 7 other adult Borders.
Any advice/encouragement appreciated as I don't want to lose one of them
The majority of people would recommend you NEVER get two puppies, especially two puppies from the same litter.
Opposite sexes are however often easier to manage. Although what do you plan to do when the b*tch comes on heat for the first time?
Is it definately fighting and not just rough play? I only ask because they can look quite similar. Puppies will also "compete" with each other through play, either for attention from you or just to size each other up. What do they do if you walk out of the room whilst they are "fighting"?
Telling them "no" is a waste of time, they don't know what that means. You would be better seperating them into different rooms each time they fight and only allowing them to be together when you can watch them carefully and intervene.
Unfortunately we only discovered the issues regarding 2 puppies from the same litter after we had committed to getting them. Although the camp does seem to be split on the issue...
I would say it is definitely aggressive play as she tends to go for his face a lot of be time. I have ordered a separate play pen today to separate them (at least until they calm down).
With regards to her first season, if necessary he will stay with my father if necessary but they will both, eventually, be one.
You will save yourself a LOT of hard work, trouble, and ultimately have a much better chance of bringing up a well adjusted pup if you send one back to the breeder now. Not to say it CAN'T be done, but you'll have a lot more hair left at the end of it if you stick with one pup!
Taking one pup back right now might seem like (and be) the hardest thing in the world but, it quite probably IS the difference between enjoying dog ownership and raising a happy, healthy, well socialised puppy... and HATING every minute of it and raising two uncontrollable, rude dogs who cannot mix with others. Or indeed living a split life with one dog in one set of rooms and the other in another set.
Litter mates are NOT supposed to stay together and this fighting and dislike for each other is a part of the process they go through, learning how to fight and defend themselves and giving the 'push' they need to set off into the big wide world alone. Only they are trapped in your house by your desire to have two puppies at the same time.
As ever, if you decide to keep both we will still give you all the help and advice you need (as you will need plenty) but right NOW would be the best time to return one puppy, when they are still small and cute and haven't learned behaviour that will limit who can take them on in future.
Rehoming at 10 months, 12 months, 18 months, when things are likely to be MUCH worse is far far harder.
Thanks for all your replies. We did even raise the issue with the breeders when we read about the pitfalls of getting 2 from the same litter albeit after we had already decided to get 2. In their defence there was no pressure to take and also no reason for them to want us to take 2. They did a phenomenal job of raising them to 8 weeks and I certainly wouldn't have wanted to get them from any other breeder.
I must admit that part of me feels selfish for wanting to keep both, rather than giving them 2 independent, happy, stress free lives.
Just out of interest what constitutes normal 'play fighting' as opposed to genuine aggressive behaviour?
Normal play fighting high pitched grring squeaking and bouncing around, you will generally see them take breaks and then leap back into the game - there is little contact made teeth to skin, and what is, is inhibited carefully. If someone bites someone else too hard expect a big shriek and they back off and the game pauses for a moment or two.. then back they go for more.
If they are rolling around grring with a deeper (given their size and age it may not be much deeper) more serious tone, there are no breaks, no one jumps out for a breather then back in, then that could well be more serious.
I think the best thing to do if you can, is film it and stick it on youtube if you can manage that?
I have to say even if they ARE just play fighting, its still not great - puppies need to learn how to be adult dogs, being stuck with another puppy as your almost constant companion means you'd just learn how to be better at being a puppy! Play fighting is after all, practice for real fighting. All baby play behaviour is practice for adult 'real' behaviours after all!
Imagine toddlers left to their own devices for much of the time - they develop their own language, they in-fight a LOT even if it isnt particularly serious, and this behaviour inhibits their ability to learn to interact and understand the rest of the world. They don't NEED to learn about the rest of the world and how to speak properly and what the social norms are (ie not biting people or hitting them) because they have one another and that is enough.
