The ladydog and being on heat

[jakesmom]

Thanks so much Nettle, I'm so gratedful.

I'll do as you say and see how they are for a couple of days. She is trying to mount him and standing for him.

Jake is obsessed with her and it's getting pretty intense, which seems odd to be honest, because Jake has never shown any mature or sexual behaviour. He still doesn't c ock his leg and never even licks his 'bits'

When I originally asked the vet (well receptionist) if we shoud have him neutered because of Heidi, I have to admit she laughed at me and said no, no, that can't happen (Did I feel stupid--yes) I admit I am pretty uneducated as far as mating in dogs is concerned. I've never wanted to breed them so didn't really check it out. I've either had just dogs, just b itches, or b itchs with a neutered dog.

Thanks again Nettle.

[Nettle]

They shouldn't have made you feel small how are any of us to learn if we don't ask?

Technically an entire male can't penetrate a spayed b itch but sometimes they can and do and it isn't good for either of them, but most of all the b itch because he can bruise her badly and also introduce infection. When mated at the correct time (assuming the b itch isn't spayed) everything is softer and stretchier inside the b itch, and the natural body fluids wash out most infections (it's rare but not unknown for a b itch and /or dog to become infected during a normal mating).

So - keep them apart when you can't supervise, and if this carries on, get her tested for hormone imbalance. There are quite a few illnesses that show this way, most easily treated once diagnosed.

[PikiPiki]

My Evee came into heat a few days ago. She dripped for a couple of days, but now there's no more fluid.


Exercising is almost impossible! She's staying at my parents' house, in the country, until we're out of KS. There's dogs running around everywhere. We can't get her out the door, there's always a big male waiting on the deck. One of them is clawing the door and barking. His owner comes and gets him, but he comes right back. He lives 2 miles away, and is almost out there 24-7. How do I safely walk her? If the suggestion is pack her into the car, that's not easy at all. He tries mounting her the second he sees her. We can't approach him, he's skittish and growls. So we can't toss a lead on him.



This is the most problematic male for us. The others go back home if she doesn't 'make an appearance'.

Evee's going bonkers wanting to get to them. She's got herself perched on top the couch to watch Stanley, the dog, on the deck all day. She's eating less, also. Right now her exercise is tug-o-war and the like.

[runlikethewind]

You should talk to the owner and ask the owner to keep the dog under control. I have no concept of what it must be like to find random dogs lying on your doorstep like this - it just doesn't occur here (at least where I live LOL). You poor thing to have this to deal with as well. The responsibility for him is with his owner - not you. You need to find a way to get to your car so you can walk her ( as Nettle says she needs to be walked...still) and I think that means asking the owner to collect him properly.

Edited as I just thought of a product I used - you might have it in USA. All natural ingredients - could help the boy smell her less

http://www.jvp.co.uk/catsdogs.php - called B*tch and deodorant tablets with parsely, peppermint.

[PikiPiki]

His owner claims that he's jumping a 6 foot fence, knows how to open doors, and his garage door. He doesn't look too smart, but who knows. He has no plan to take any more action. He said that Evee's a beautiful dog, and he wouldn't mind a puppy. That really irritated me. I'm not the type to call the humane society and have the dog removed though. ='[

I had no idea there was anything like that on the market. I'm going to go to the pet stores around here, and see if I can find anything like that. Thank you for showing me it.

[Suzette]

I just came across this thread and want to thank Nettle SO much for writing this. Thanks to all the information I've gleaned during my time on the forum, I know that I'm going to wait until Piper's gone through at least one heat cycle, if not two, before spaying. I have to admit, the thought was daunting to me since I've never had one of my female dogs go through a heat cycle. Now I know just what to expect and how to handle each stage of this process. Again, thank you Nettle, this information is invaluable to me.

Piki, I'm so sorry for what your neighbor is putting you through. I understand your not wanted to call animal control - afterall, the dog is just being a dog. It's his owner's responsibility to keep him properly contained at all times. However, my mother had a very similar situation several years ago. In utter frustration after months of her dog being terrorized, she did end up calling animal control on the neighbor's dog (my mom's dog often couldn't even get outside to potty because this dog was always in her yard. Her dog was spayed, so it wasn't a mating issue, just an aggression issue the other dog had with my mother's dog). In the end, the guy had to pay to get his dog back from animal control and that ended the dog's running. After that, the neighbor kept his dog under control a lot better. Sometimes if you can't use reason, hitting them in the wallet will get the job done.

Anyway, I hope you find a solution soon. Poor Evee and poor you.

[Loralee]

I just want to say thank you for this thread Nettle!

We decided to wait to spay Molly, and she went through her first heat without any problems! It really wasn't bad at all. I think it helped that it was in August(the hottest month of the year) so there weren't to many dogs out and about. It was funny though, not to mention a tad awkward, when we would meet up with other dogs, (neutered males)and females, and they just couldn't get enough of sniffing her girly parts, then I'd have to explain to the owners why. LOL Thankfully most people were ok, and supportive of our decision. She never really did the standing thing though, a few times we would meet up with the dog across the street (Buddy) and she would just swing her tail in his face, like she was teasing him. He really didn't react to her though, don't know if it was the heat or the fact that he was neutered. LOL

She did bleed for the full 21 days+, it was actually closer to a month. It definitely slowed down after the first ten days, but she was still leaking the rest of the month. It wasn't bad at all though, just a drop here and there, and mostly first thing in the am, or after she'd been resting for awhile. Now I'm just hoping her next cycle will be just as easy. lol

I do have a question though, it's been a little over a month since her cycle ended, and I was wondering if the false pregnancy starts about 2 months from when her heat first starts or is it 2 months from when it ends? I just want to be on the look out for any signs, especially when the kids are around her, not to mention be able to understand any behavior changes that might occur.

Thanks again for all the great info! I can't tell you how relieved I felt once we made the decision to wait until she's fully mature before we get her spayed. I felt like this huge weight had been lifted.

[Loralee]

Oh and I just wanted to add to Piki, I hope your neighbor got his dog under control, and has left Evee alone. I can't believe he actually said he wouldn't mind a puppy from her. Now that is someone who should have his dog fixed, because he doesn't seem to be very responsible for his dog.

We have a new dog in the neighborhood who's not neutered, Duke, he's a beautiful 2 year old doberman and Molly loves him, but his owners are very responsible. And make sure everyone knows he's not neutered, and that he doesn't get too much freedom around Molly. lol

[Nettle]

I was wondering if the false pregnancy starts about 2 months from when her heat first starts or is it 2 months from when it ends?

Two months from about the middle of the season, which is when most conception would have taken place - but they do vary, just as we do. Some don't have much in the way of a false pregnancy at all, and some are so convincing you catch yourself knitting bootees.

[Loralee]

Thank you! I really hope it's not quite noticeable, just because I really don't want the kids to think she's going to have puppies. Especially my youngest, he's 9 and is always trying to talk us into letting Molly get married, so she can have puppies. LOL

[bendog]

I've read that you think it best to wait until the b itch is at least 2 or 3 before getting her neutered, and waiting 3 months after a season.

I've heard that you should always let a b itch have at least one litter of puppies, before you get her spayed...would you recommend this or is it a load of rubbish?

I've never really had a girl dog before so I don't really know.
The one I live with just gets really down when she has a season and mopes around but it isn't too messy, usually just means washing a couple of cushion covers.

[Nettle]

I've read that you think it best to wait until the b itch is at least 2 or 3 before getting her neutered, and waiting 3 months after a season.

Yes, i'd go along with that as good general advice, though sometimes a b itch has to be neutered earlier or later for specific reasons.

I've heard that you should always let a b itch have at least one litter of puppies, before you get her spayed...would you recommend this or is it a load of rubbish?

I wouldn't recommend that. There would be a lot of unwanted puppies about if every b itch was bred, so IMO it's best to leave the breeding to people who are improving the breed by doing so.

[ClareMarsh]

Nettle, I have a question for you. I don't have a b tch, (although I might get one in the future) but I was at my first dog training class last week and the trainer went into a bit of a rant about b tches in season. It started off as if they're in season don't bring to the class (which made sense) but then expanded into don't walk them at all when in heat as a dog can smell from 3 miles away and you can cause accidents (she has witnessed a fatality due to a dog chasing a b tch) and loss of off leash dogs as they chase after the b tch. We live in a urban area and yes there are lots of dogs around but surely there are ways of walking your b tch and keeping her and other dogs safe?

She told us all we needed to spread the word on this as it was very important (she also cited a well behaved dog of hers that had run off in such a circumstance which I think was swaying her view). I wanted to get your thoughts on this as to lock up a b tch for 3 weeks seems cruel, but I can also see that not being considerate when walking her can cause trouble.

I'll stop rambling now, hope you don't mind me asking as it's not to do with a dog I own just general brain picking

[Nettle]

Pleased to advise, and I speak from the perspective of someone who owns both whole bitches and a retired stud dog - and I have a number of friends with the same.

All dogs need exercise. Therefore when my bitches are on heat I still walk them twice a day. In consideration to others, and also as risk management, I walk them at off-peak times for other dog-walkers (you soon get to know the 'pattern' in your own area) places where I can see a long way off, and although they still get their off-lead time, they do spend more time than usual on the lead as I don't want them out of sight, even if it's just behind that patch of undergrowth.

If on-heat bitches are not exercised, it is bad for their physical health as well as their mental health, as exercise helps keep the fluids flowing. I do wonder if pyometra cases are usually with bitches that don't get exercised? You can play Occupy the Mind games with on-heat bitches but they still need physical exercise.

Effect on other dogs? Of course they know a b itch is in season and are interested, but they don't all turn into sex-crazed monsters (some do). My stud dog was so experienced that he did not bother a b itch on heat at all until she was actually ovulating, and even then I could call him away and he would come back to me. Not all dogs are as obliging, or dare I say it - as well-trained

If someone has a dog that escapes after bitches, that is a matter of improving fencing. If someone has a dog that runs off after bitches, that is a matter of control. Some male dogs do stress when there is an on-heat b itch in the area, and equally some b itches would run off and find a dog if they could. Keeping entire dogs of either gender involves a bigger responsibility and a bigger commitment to avoiding unwanted puppies.

I am responsible for my dogs and others are responsible for theirs. I am not about to have my dogs mutilated because other people can't manage theirs. Nor am I about to make life difficult for others because I choose to keep my dogs whole. It's all about consideration.


I find your trainer's views are understandably coloured by what SHE has experienced because HER dog wasn't properly trained or confined. That doesn't make her loss any less unhappy, but she is doing the classical human thing of projecting the blame onto someone else. If you watch your dog, it will tell you what it is scenting, and whether it is about to follow that scent. You get plenty of time to think Hmmm seems to be a b itch about - and put him on the lead. Dogs that run off are just as likely to do so from scenting a deer or a rabbit as a b itch on heat.

Funnily enough, I know a few trainers who welcome on-heat b itches in their classes because they say a dog should be obedient no matter what is going on around it. I'm not sure I agree, but here's food for thought.

[ClareMarsh]

Thanks Nettle, what you suggest is what I would have thought (although not with the experience of knowing when a dog can scent a b tch etc). We had a b tch when I was a teenager and we used to walk her in more remote areas when she was in season and never had a problem.

One of the many great things to come out of owning Ted has been not automatically accepting what people in "authority" tell me but rather thinking more for myself so when she said that and I read this thread I got to thinking

Oh and another great thing has been finding this forum and people with such great experience to help us both