Rehabilitating a Puppy Mill Momma

[Patrice]

J9Padge...what a scary moment for you. I'm sure someone with far more experience than I will have some insightful advice. I am fortunate with Molly in that she is extremely non-agressive. She's a runner not a fighter and in worst case, she just shuts down. This is how she was when I got her. If she doesn't want to deal with something she just avoids it.

My best guess is that after 6 months, your dog and you have bonded and she feels secure enough with you, trusts you. When you went inside, she was without her guardian/protector and when your friend did something as innocent but sudden as standing up, your dog lashed out in fear.

I'm not sure if it was this thread or another one where I said it can be "fun" learning what triggers your dog. I'd say you just found one and need to ensure in future that visitors do not make any sudden movements, escpecially when you are not around. I've noticed that Molly will accept some people petting her if I'm around but if I'm in another room or several feet away and someone tries to pet her she will instantly shy away. She's braver when I'm there.

Hopefully others will have more useful advice.

[freetobe]

J9Page....I'm sure that was really scary. But Patrice is right that does sound like a trigger. And maybe there is some way of working her through that when you are around.

My pup Lola is the same as yours Patrice. When she is frightened she just shuts down and turns into a puddle on the floor. Her confidence seems to be building tho.
Housebreaking is going really well right now too. We have gone almost 2 days with zero accidents.

I just got a book in the mail today called Puppy Mill Dogs SPEAK! Have any of you read this book? I only just read the intro so I can't say much about it yet.

[Patrice]

Freetobe, no I haven't read it but I did just order it. The only book I read specfically about puppy mill dogs was "Saving Gracie: How One Dog Escaped the Shadowy World of American Puppy Mills." It was a sad but interesting read but dealt more with raising awareness about puppy mills, how this particular one was shut down and only a small amount on the problems and challenges involved in rehabbing a puppy mill rescue.

Lola does sound like Molly, who also used to lie in her crate with her face to the wall, back facing out or anywhere else avoiding eye contact. You could just hear her thinking, "If I can't see them they don't exist" over and over...

[emmabeth]

J9Page - can you start your own thread about your dog and what happened. We can definitely offer some advice, both to help you manage your dog safely and to address the specific problems.

Leaving the dog alone and then the stranger standing up does sound very much like it triggered the dogs reaction, very scary for all of you and I do hope your guest was understanding about it!

[freetobe]

Attempted our first walk today. It did not look like it was going to happen, she put the brakes on almost right away. But then I redirected her and she just followed right along. One thing I did not even think of is rail road tracks. We live 2 houses down from train tracks. She handled it very well. Only hesitated for a moment.
but I could tell she was feeling a little stressed so we just went about 1/2 a block and then turned around. Right as we were walking back up to our yard a car drove by kind of fast and she just dropped to the ground. (we live on a dirt road so no sidewalks) I think all in all it went ok.
I'm just wondering how often I should do this...everyday?

I let her sleep out in the main house the last two nights and she has done great! No messes in the house in almost 4 days!! She is making great progress, but still will not let us touch her really. She comes up and sniffs us but backs right away if you try to touch her. So she still has a lot to work on.

Reading the SPEAK! Puppy mill dog book and have gotten a few good ideas from it. I was able to get her to eat out of my hand for the first time last night.

[emmabeth]

I think that walk was possibly a little too much, a few scary things happened and that will colour her view of walking and of time spent with you.

Instead for a few weeks, I would just go out your gateway/driveway and sit, a good distance back from the road and give her a tasty treat whenever something goes by.

If she wont take the treat (and you know its something she likes and would take indoors) then thats a clear indication that things are too scary for her and you need to increase the distance she is from wahtever frightens her.

Work at her pace - she won't get over her fears by facing them, because she cannot reason out whats happening. Where we might think 'ok that was scary but actually nothing bad happened', she won't, she just remembers 'that was scary and I couldnt get away'.

[freetobe]

Thanks emmabeth....
I was thinking that for now I would just try to walk her around our yard. We have an acre lot so I thought if I could just do a loop around our yard and then gradually do more and more loops until she is totally comfortable walking with me. Once she is comfortable with that I will try taking her out on the road again.

[emmabeth]

Yep, teach her walking with you is fun, its rewarding you have treats or toys or whatever.

Gradually add in a peep out of the front gate as you do a loop of the yard, or a few steps down the street and back, or then a few steps down, cross the road, come back, cross back and back home... Build it up slowly - if you go too slow the worst that can happen is it takes longer than maybe it needed to. If you go too FAST the worst that can happen is she gets more frightened and you have new issues to sort out and it takes even longer.

Once you get to know her and she begins to trust you, you will find you can work at a faster pace, but it is very early days yet and the world is a new and scary place for her, shes never had a person she could trust before either!

[freetobe]

I have yet another question for you all.

J9Padge, I know you said you have a maltese so maybe you have run into this same problem. My Lola is a Lhasa Apso, so she needs to be groomed regularly. Right now she is trimmed down pretty short, but she is kind of a dirty dog. Her little paws get really dirty and she has tear stains that get a little gunky. She also has gotten a few burs on her legs.
The burs I was able to trim out. But yesterday I tried to give her a little bath to clean up her paws and she did not enjoy it. Aside from baths I feel like I need to start brushing her, but she is still uncomfortable being pet. So I'm just wondering if any one has any tips on getting her more comfortable with being groomed.

[j9padge]

Grooming! That is certainly a big issue. Alice my Maltese gets very runny tears, stains and gunk. I cannot approach her with anything in my hand, a cotton ball, washcloth etc. It is gross but I just try to pet her eyes when we are sitting on the couch and remove the gunk before it gets crusted. I have a metal comb that I can do a few strokes on her but it is nowhere near the amount that she needs to be combed to keep from getting matted. Since she loves to be petted, I wait til she is calm and almost asleep and sneak in a couple of strokes. Also, she gets really dirty feet and legs but doesn't like to be wiped (I have not even attempted to dip her in a tub). And those burs are magnetically attracted to her soft hair! I had to make an "emergency" trip to the grooomer when she walked through a patch and was covered with them a month ago. I found a very understanding groomer who let me make an appointment, hand her my dog and come back an hour later. I told them about her history and that I didn't want her caged and they were extremely kind and understanding. I said that I was going to be a "high maintenance" customer but this was a very special little dog. She was so sweet that she gave me a brush, comb and breath spray as an "adoption" gift!
I just had her groomed for the third time since adopting her and I think I waited too long in between cuts because the hair was partially covering her eyes. After her cut, she seemed extremely wide-eyed and paranoid at every little movement she saw. I think the unobstructed vision freaked her out! I will see if I can go in for a trim in between full grooming sessions just to trim the hair over her eyes. I hope in time, that she will allow me to do it. Her cut was on Monday and she is still not "herself" yet.

[KimnBoys]

My name is Kim and I applaud you for taking in these wonderful souls and giving them a second chance--I have 2 boys who were rescued from a lab...feel free to browse my story, problems and wonderful advice and I see you already have wonderful responses from people who have been helping me along...THEY ARE WONDERFUL HERE nothing seems impossible, some days are and will be harder than others, and I find it is time to log on and get help lol these people are just the best , we live on It's Me Or The Dog lol and her book by the same name ................................don't give up....heres your help line USE IT USE THE PEOPLE HERE THEY ARE THE BEST AND HAVE GOTTEN ME THROUGH AND ALWAYS PICK ME UP WHEN I NEED IT.....Kim

[freetobe]

Thanks for the encouragement!
I have been feeling a little frustrated over the last few days. She seems mad at me over the bath. She has never been very comfortable with petting, but she would relax and let me pet her. But over the last day she won't let me touch her at all. It makes me kind of crazy because even though she won't let me touch her, she follows me pretty much every where. When we are outside and my other dog comes running up to me she does too, so naturally I just want to reach down and pet her....but all she'll give me is a little sniff.
My husband said to me yesterday..."You know there are a lot of dogs out there that need homes, that will actually let you touch them"
I just said someday she will.
and I just have to keep telling myself that.

[Mattie]

It sounds like you bathing her has destroyed some of the trust you had built up, I never bath my dogs, I don't find it necessary as long as I brush them regularly depending on if they are moulting or not. If you insist on bathing her you need to work up to it and not do it in one, clicker training will help with this.

Why are you insisting on petting her when she doesn't like it, only tollerates it? I have taken on dogs that were terrified if a hand went near them, by leaving them alone and not insisting on petting them they gained trust and eventually loved to be tickled and stroked. You have damaged her trust in you no wonder she won't let you do it now, you will have to go back to the beginning and try and gain her trust but it is going to be a lot harder now.

[KimnBoys]

dont give up on her--as I have learned move at their pace--Justice when he got here was all about me kisses, some days I could not pet him but would follow me around so it was like okay whatever feels right for him ... etc and not til the past 2 weeks or so would he only kiss me he has just started to kiss daddy lol it will take time for her to come around, just stay positive and think about it like this-if she has never been able to or had that kind of affection it will take awhile for her to accept it and return it am I making sense??? Time will help her know it is okay to give kisses etc, when Justice would not kiss etc daddy would just say ok when you are ready, but yet he would sit next to him on occasion take a pet from him but it was on his terms, when he was ready, of course with us we really do not know their whole story sooooo ....just be patient and your hubby too stay positive....She will come around and what a great moment it will be ---hope this makes sense lol

[Mattie]

My husband said to me yesterday..."You know there are a lot of dogs out there that need homes, that will actually let you touch them"
I just said someday she will.
and I just have to keep telling myself that.

Sorry I meant to reply to this part as well,

There may be lots of dogs that need homes that will let you touch them but they are not this dog, just because you have had a set back doesn't mean that you can't turn her round, you can, and the pleasure you get when you have is unbelievable so keep working with her. You know us well enough now to know we don't pussyfoot around but that doesn't mean we think you can't work with this dog, you can especially with our help.

Keep telling yourself that she will eventually become the dog you want, just take things a bit slower, if she smells spray some nice smells round the room to disguise it until you can work with her. Start now using a clicker to get her to think nice things happen when you groom her, take it very slowly. Try starting with a long feather, when she sniffs it, click and treat, next touch her with it, only a quick touch, click and treat, build up until she is happy to be stroked with the feather you can then continue in tiny steps to accept your hand.

If she gets muddy, it comes off when it is dry so why make work for yourself by washing it off, it is much easier to whip round with a mop or cleaner than to wash her feet even if she was used to this.

Just slow down and you will get there with her.