Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Share your favorite training tips, ideas and methods with other Positively members!

Moderators: emmabeth, BoardHost

Post Reply
kyyoot
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 11:18 am

Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by kyyoot »

HELP! I have a 4 month old Papillon puppy. He is extremely smart, responsive, and sweet tempered. The only problem I find is he still has some separation anxiety issues. I can leave the room and go about my business without much response but when I head down the stairs or open the door, or if he even hears the car engine starts he goes into a fit. I had to put him into a large X-pen so he would stop eliminating by the door (he rarely makes potty mistakes). I'm not quite sure how long the howling goes on for while I'm gone however, he does not seem to be very destructive so that's a relief. My parents come and check up on him. He is perfectly content playing on his own as long as he knows someone is around. The only problem is that I am going to be moving to an apartment and I am worried he is going to bark/howl his head off. I have tried to desensitize him to clues as to my leaving (picking up keys, putting on shoes, grabbing my purse, etc) however I cannot really do anything about him hearing the car starting. He understands the commands to come, stay, sit, down, paw, even roll over! I have tried leaving at different periods and even distracting him with a Kong filled with peanut butter. It hasn't shown much change. He sleeps alone with his crate in the pen where he doesn't have problems sleeping.

Recently he has also picked up the disgusting habit of eating his feces. I don't know when it started exactly but he wasn't always doing it which is why I don't think he picked it up from watching his mother's behavior. I never yelled at him for mistakes, I just placed him in his crate and cleaned the mess along with special de-odorizing spray when he could not see. I give him a mix of foods so he has variation in his diet. I know I feed him enough because he usually leaves a little if he is too full to finish so I do not think he eats his feces from hunger. I tried to feed him spinach; didn't work. I tried to feed him pineapple; didn't work.

I am at a loss; please help!
kyyoot
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 11:18 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by kyyoot »

ANYBODY?? :cry:
jacksdad
Posts: 4887
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:48 pm

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by jacksdad »

kyyoot, sometimes questions get lost in the shuffle, I doubt you are being ignored.

while my dog also has a touch of separation issues it had never gotten full blown and I have been able to help him with my leaving by making my leaving as calm as possible, and giving him a food filled kong as the last thing I do before going out the door. I started doing this in Dec/January. He has gone from whining and big "bug" eyes with dilated pupils and panic, to calm and a general attitude of "come on man, were is my KONG"

So, your basically on the right track.....HOWEVER, my dog is an adult and you have a puppy, there maybe some puppy development phases going on here in addition to any possible separation anxiety

I am sure the experts in these issue will comment soon. in the mean time, separation anxiety, puppy development issues and poop eating are fairly common questions, do be sure to use the search feature of the forum if your really anxious for some answers.

I wish I had more to offer, but poop eating and puppy development are not an area I have any experience in at this time.
kyyoot
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 11:18 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by kyyoot »

Thank you for your response. I only wish to react quickly before the problem worstens.
emmabeth
Posts: 8894
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:24 pm
Location: West Midlands
Contact:

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by emmabeth »

Sorry yes this got missed when I was moving posts around the other night!

It may actually be that you are over feeding - pups will often eat more than they really need and the result can be that food travels too quickly through the digestive system, meaning that what comes out the other end is only partially digested.. and thus still has some nutritional benefit to it/tastes good.

Try feeding less, I usually figure out how much a pup WOULD eat given the opportunity, and then feed them just 3/4 of that amount.

YOu are on the right track as far as the seperation anxiety goes - have you desensitized your pup to you going out, getting in the car, shutting the door.... then coming right back in again? And then do the same but run the engine for a little while then go back in.. then drive a little way down the street and then walk back in... etc etc...

Another thing that may help is a visual cue - dogs pick up on visual cues all the time, for instance picking up your keys and putting on a certain coat and shoes may mean walkies, picking up keys and a different coat and a bag and different shoes may mean you are going out to work...

You can use this to your advantage - you can pick a random, odd item, lets say a beach ball - put that out and then ignore your pup for a few minutes. Put it away and then you can pay your dog attention.

Build up using that item (whatever it is you choose it just needs to be sufficiently out of place as to be really obvious when its there and when its not) so that you can leave the room, leave the house, get in the car, start the engine, drive a little way.. and he understands that the whole time that item is there, it doesnt matter WHERE you are he wont get any attention from you.

My dogs visual cue for 'no attention' is... surprise surprise... me sat at my computer desk! If i sit here they immediately go to sleep!
West Midlands based 1-2-1 Training & Behaviour Canine Consultant
User avatar
yogismom
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 2:49 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by yogismom »

My five-month old Pomeranian eats his poop, no matter if he's going outside or inside, we have to catch him immediately. My vet recommended putting meat tenderizer over his puppy kibble and it's supposed to taste good going down, but very nasty coming out... it discourages them from eating it. I haven't tried it yet.... but that's what he told me to do.
kyyoot
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 11:18 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by kyyoot »

Thank you for your responses. As far as the desensitizing goes with the visual cues, it happens naturally as I am constantly changing the bags i use, where i put them, where i pick them up, what clothes i wear out. All my puppy knows is that come that time of day, he knows I'm gone. I go up and down the stairs a lot when I am at home so I think he is alright with that; even with the car starting he's ok if it's later on in the day. He has started to chew up his newspaper when anxious which is not a great sign. I give him a kong with peanut butter before I go except I have to be careful with the amount as he's gotten runny poo from too much peanut butter (He is only 3.5 lbs).

When it comes to the poo eating, I have tried lessening the amount I give him and have made sure he eats his food slowly. He is still not deterred. I tried spraying bitter apple on the poo but that just deters him from going near the paper to eliminate. He is stubborn and as silly as this sounds, he tries to hold it in until no one is there to watch him which is when he eliminates and feasts (yuck). The foods that supposedly taste bad as feces has not deterred him either. As I cannot watch him 24/7 and catch him defacating all the time I feel I am starting to run out of options.
jacksdad
Posts: 4887
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:48 pm

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by jacksdad »

nothing says you have to only use peanut butter in the kong. you can use any dog safe food he enjoys. I used to use a little peanut butter in the kong too, but have since switched to just feeding him his breakfast from it. try that. a small portion of his daily meal broken off and used to distract him while you leave.
kyyoot
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 11:18 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by kyyoot »

Will do; a variety of treats may work.
shining-one
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:08 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by shining-one »

My puppy ate his poo and the vet said to try and catch him doing it and put chilli powder on it. Although I didn't catch him doing it all the time when I did the chilli powder was very effective. He is five months old now and rarely eats his poo. thank goodness!
kyyoot
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 11:18 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by kyyoot »

Yes, I heard of a method where you take the poo away when the puppy isn't' watching, cut it length wise and stuff it with chill pepper/flakes/seeds/etc and put it back again when he isn't watching. I've heard that is quite effect, however I was hoping to try and save that as a LAST resort.
shining-one
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:08 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by shining-one »

I don't think you need to go to the lengths of cutting it in half and stuffing it!! I just distract the puppy have the pot of chilli powder in one hand, then walk past the poo and tip the chilli powder over it. Even when the puppy did see me do it it was effective. Good luck!!
kyyoot
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 11:18 am

Re: Separation Anxiety - Poo Eating (Coprophagy)

Post by kyyoot »

Operation chilli powder was a fail; I even went so far as to remove him from the site, take the poo, incorpoate some chili powder within the poo 007 style, place it back where he had pooed, brought him back on site and went about my business. The massive amount of chili powder has not deterred him in the slightest. :?
Post Reply