New puppy need help!

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CharleyS
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:37 am

New puppy need help!

Post by CharleyS »

Ok, we've had him only one night. I'm starting with honesty. We despertely wanted a puppy (he's a labrador - has no name yet), but did not fully realise how hard it would be. I am taking responsibility for making a decision that could turn out to be a wrong one, which is why we need help to make a decision. We can keep him and try or we can (possibly??) try to give him back:
We have 2 children: a 4yr old and a 10 month old (who is walking aided).
The main problems are that he is very boisterous (normal pup behaviour, I know) and knocks over the youngest and jumps up at the eldest child. I feel like they cant play and that suddenly a home that was there's has ceased to be there's if you understand what i'm saying.
Last night was awful. He howled very loudly for 2 hours until my husband went and slept on the sofa with the pup on the floor. I am told that you have to ignore it but how do you do that when you live in a terraced house? I have tried putting him in the kitchen with a stair gate up for short periods but he just howls to be let back in with us and when I went to do the school run this morning I could hear him howling when I left and when I returned.
I know these things take time but I am at home all day with the children and the puppy and its me that all this will fall to. I havent had a dog before, although my husband has but he grew up her so he wasnt responsible for her as a puppy.
I'm not asking for criticism please, I can do that for myself. Just people who have been there and are willing to help us make a very difficult decision, one way or another.
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Nettle
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Re: New puppy need help!

Post by Nettle »

Take him straight back. By far the kindest thing to do for all of you. Consider getting a dog when your youngest starts big school and you ahve time to look after and train what is another baby, but one that will never speak the language you do and cannot be reasoned with.

It's a shedload and a half of work to rear a puppy properly, and you have plenty of work and more with what you are already doing.

Treat it as a life lesson and take him back TODAY while there is a chance he can find a home more suited to his needs. (I do wonder at the breeder - you would not have had a puppy from me at this stage of your life).
A dog is never bad or naughty - it is simply being a dog

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CharleyS
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Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:37 am

Re: New puppy need help!

Post by CharleyS »

Thank you for your comment. You are right, thats the problem that we face. The breeder was not a great one, wasnt even that fussed when we said she could phone and check up on him anytime. She doesnt want to take the puppy back either - she said she would talk to her husband and phone me back but so far neither have phoned and that was 3 hours ago.
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sez88
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Location: Plymouth

Re: New puppy need help!

Post by sez88 »

Hey :)
Glad you found this forum. (its sarah here btw in case u didnt already work that out!)
Nettle is right, if you are going to rehome him it will only get harder.
That in mind Im so so glad we didnt rehome charlie now, but then we didnt have kids to deal with as well.
Any news from the breeder yet?
x
Enjoying life with our pup charlie...he had us at 'woof'!
CharleyS
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:37 am

Re: New puppy need help!

Post by CharleyS »

I just rung them again and he said no. I was so upset I cried (I dont know whats wrong with me today - I never cry!!!). He just said we have to train him. Having said that he said he hated me being upset and told me he'd ring back when his wife came home. Not that I want him to. I said it didnt matter. I hope he didnt think I was crying to get sympathy cos like i said, I dont normally cry!! I think its just the responsibility kicking in. I just want him to stop barking and howling - I've tried putting him in the kitchen behind the gate again with us in the adjoining room so he can still see us but he's so loud I darent do it for long. Apart from that he's been really good today. If we can get over the separation anxiety, we can work on the other stuff.
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sez88
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Location: Plymouth

Re: New puppy need help!

Post by sez88 »

Oh thats helpful!
Are you putting him in a dif room to seperate him for your little girl? or just to get him used to it?
Will he use his crate yet?
x
Enjoying life with our pup charlie...he had us at 'woof'!
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Nettle
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Re: New puppy need help!

Post by Nettle »

Oh poor you - listen you have loads of sympathy and empathy from us. Most of us have been there in varying degrees, at least for knowing how much work a pup is.

But my dear, you must be tough. Take that pup back. Go round there with your man and do that. Never mind phone calls. Alternatively if you have a labrador rescue in your area or a good shelter, place him there. He will find a home in no time at this age.

Frankly, if the breeder has that attitude, he is probably not a healthy specimen either. I know it's hard with those big puppy eyes, I know he didn't choose any of this, but your first responsibilities are to your children, and as far as the pup is concerned, you plain don't have the time or the energy.

This is a time for logic not sentiment. I am absolutely not offering any criticism, but if you keep the pup you cannot give him what he needs.
A dog is never bad or naughty - it is simply being a dog

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Mattie
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Re: New puppy need help!

Post by Mattie »

I think you are in need of a BIG HUG, we have all been there so really do understand.

How old is your pup?
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zekesmom
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Location: Georgia

Re: New puppy need help!

Post by zekesmom »

I do really feel for you. Especially since you all dearly wanted a puppy. But, I do feel it would be best for you all if you found another home for this puppy. I have a 6 year old son, 2 year old daughter, and 6 month old lab puppy. We are fortunate enough to have a basement and fenced backyard for the dog. I have had to keep my children away from Zeke because he is so large and happy/jumpy. We would not have kept him if he was in our living space, since I am afraid he'll accidentally hurt my children because of his size. It was only this week that my 6 year old son felt comfortable getting around Zeke. It seems that you are already beating your self up and regretting this. Well, the cute puppy will soon be huge, and more than likely mouthing/nipping. You won't be able to trust the dog alone in a room with your children for a couple of years. It doesn't seem fair to all of you to run your life around that concept. Plus, with a one year old, how will you walk to the dog? If you don't walk a lab, they will be destructive and hard to handle. Please understand that I am speaking from my current situation. Zeke is now over 60 pounds. He is hard for me to handle when he wants to run after something. I can take my 6 year old son on a walk with us, but not my little girl.

If you are desperate for a puppy, then wait maybe another year or so. Then please consider a smaller size dog. I knew full well what I was getting in to with a lab, since my family raised a few of them. Even at that, it's been hard to handle. To be honest, my husband regrets getting the dog since he wasn't aware of what it involved. We've made it through the worst of it. It was huge that my son will now spend time with Zeke. I just can't say it enough - do yourself a favor and find a home for the puppy. I think that you know that is the answer, since you are crying about it. It sucks and it hurts. I'm so sorry you are having to deal with this!
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emmabeth
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Re: New puppy need help!

Post by emmabeth »

Oh dear :(

I would attempt to take this pup back, as per Nettles suggestion - go round with your partner and the pup and hand it back. If things get nasty fair enough just walk away but the chances are, they will take the pup back if you show up with him.

If not - look at various rescues, phone them, be honest you thought you could manage this and now you realise it was a terrible mistake and that you have tried to return to the breeder but now they have your money they couldnt give a monkeys.

I don't think you should keep this pup, the ages of your children mean that normal puppy behaviour will be scary and potentially dangerous for them and that preventing this is going to mean either the puppy misses out... or your children miss out, on some necessary parts of their daily lives.

That said you may struggle to get him into rescue immediately you may need to wait a few days or so... so in the meantime..

Take him to your room with you at night - yes ignoring them when they cry means they learn no one comes when they cry. but it can easily also mean they learn to cry SO loudly you CANNOT ignore them and where most of us live with close neighbours its not practical to do this. So have him in your room means hes quiet and hes not stressed.

It also means you can wake up and take him out immediately he stirs in the night (if you dont have a dog crate, and cannot borrow one, get a BIG cardboard box so you will hear him getting out of it in the night) so that he doesnt learn to poo/pee indoors.

The judicious use of baby gates can help a lot with keeping a puppy seperate but not completely excluded from family life.

Feeding him things that take a while to eat will tire him out a lot - look for Kong dog toys that you can pack food into, (dont bother with tiny puppy ones get a couple of medium sized ones if you can), hiding dry food in a cardboard box with twists of newspaper (like a box full of mini 'pass the parcel' parcels) can be a good entertainment for a pup, do make sure theres not too much newspaper though as he may eat some of it rather than just the treats. That will make a mess for you to clean up... but it will be easier to do that than sort out crying children from a puppy trying to chew their shoes off their feet.

Dont let the kids run and make noise around him, and try to pick times when hes sleepy and cuddly for them to pet him, rather than when hes bouncy.

I do hope you find somewhere suitable for this pup to go, it sounds like his breeders are a pretty uncaring lot to have sold him to you in the first place and now not give a wotsits about him.

Everyone who has a pup has a 'omg what have I done' moment.. but in your case I think you are correct, the timing is not right and when it IS right.... I'm sure you will do fine.

Big hugs for you!
West Midlands based 1-2-1 Training & Behaviour Canine Consultant
CharleyS
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Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:37 am

Re: New puppy need help!

Post by CharleyS »

Thank you all. Its such a tough decision. We've just paid hundreds of pounds for him (plus extra for crate, toys, food, bowls etc) and that makes it even harder to give him away. Since we have no choice about handing him back to them now I think we just have to see what the next few days brings. I really dont want to hand him back to them anyway. We've paid them lots of money and they really cant be bothered so why should I allow them to sell him on again and make themselves more money, probably to another family who arent ready for him? Even if they did accept him back, I bet their condition would be that they will keep the money :( I think if it comes to it then yes, we will have to think about selling him to a home with no children or giving him to the Labrador Rescue here.

This afternoon has been better. I finally got him to go into and lie down and sleep in his (canvas) crate/transport box and also spend time in the kitchen with the gate shut. He did howl when I took my eldest up to bed but thats an improvement. I also had to go out this afternoon to an appointment and when I came home there was no noise and he'd pee-ed on the newspaper which was great. Ive very glad we dont have a carpeted floor in this house. I played with him with my eldest this afternoon and it was really lovely.

I still feel sick with worry but I feel better than I did this morning and last night. I think we at least owe it to the little man to try for the next few days, whatever the outcome may be at the end of the week. So thank you for your honesty, its has all been taken on board and will be mulled over!
china_cat84
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Re: New puppy need help!

Post by china_cat84 »

So sorry you've had this happen to you! It sounds like such an awful mess - and the breeders themselves sound awful. Did you see the situation that your puppy was living in? Makes me wonder if the puppies/dogs were living in a clean, decent environment since the breeders obviously don't care about the welfare of their puppies. For all they know, after you told them you wanted to give him back and they said no, you went and dumped him in a ditch somewhere! I don't know about where you live, but here that happens a lot - especially with larger dogs like labs.

First of all, and I know this is difficult, but you and your husband need to CALM down a bit. You've only had him for a little while and he's just getting used to you. He's in a new home, away from his mother and everything else that was familiar. You'd probably cry and howl too if you were in the same situation. Every puppy I've ever owned howled, cried, and barked when they were locked away from people (especially at bed time). By giving in to his cries, you teach him that by howling and crying he will get what he wants and that can create a huge barking problem in the future!

Now is the time to start training. Ignore his complaining. Reward him with treats, affection, and playtime when he's good. Try desensitizing him to the crate and the kitchen (if that's where you will have him stay at night and when you're gone). Teach him that the crate and the kitchen are areas where he gets yummy treats and lots of affection. If he's only in those places when you're in bed or out, he will think of himself as being banished and he will relate negative experiences to those places. It's very important to train his to like the crate and the kitchen now, because when he gets larger he will be much more difficult to handle! I would also suggest to train him on the lead once he's had his shots and everything. You definitely don't want him to get larger and pull you down the street!

Good luck and be sure to post whenever you need any more advice, have questions, or just need to talk!
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CharleyS
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Re: New puppy need help!

Post by CharleyS »

Thanks again everyone.

My husband is going to have a firm word with the breeder again today. Yes we did see how they were living - the house smelt and was dirty and they were all in a pen together but they are healthy and well fed which is good. I think they just think that as soon as they leave, the pups arent their problem anymore which isnt right - surely they have an obligation to ensure they are looked after? I mean, we ARE looking after him amazingly well, but you're right, they dont know that! If it was me in that situation, I would take him back as soon as possible regardless of what sitation I was in (ie still have 3 more older pups to rehome but thats their problem - they are being advertised on a little known website. The other most popular websites are free to advertise on so I dont understand why they arent using them!) Besides, they conciously mated their ***** to get puppies so it was their choice!!

Its very sad but we dont think we can keep him even if he does improve over time. The more and more we think about the reality of the situation and listen to others, the more stupid it makes me feel for thinking it would be ok in the first place. My husband says he keeps trying to justify the situation to himself but in reality he says its me that has to do all the work as he's at work alot of the time. I still feel sick constantly. I havent felt this crap for years and years!!
CharleyS
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Joined: Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:37 am

Re: New puppy need help!

Post by CharleyS »

Ooohhh its blanked out the word for female dog. It wasnt intended as a swear word.
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Nettle
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Re: New puppy need help!

Post by Nettle »

I'm not Nettle for nothing so pin back your ears and listen.

Take this pup back or rehome NOW TODAY or TOMORROW. Every day he spends with you makes it harder for HIM and he is the guy who matters most in this unhappy situation. It does not get better for about two years and it gets considerably worse for a very long time. Even when you know all the deal, puppies are harder work than children, I promise you.

The money you spent has gone. It was a mistake: we all make mistakes, it's money that you will replace with other money just the same and it was the price of this life lesson. You can keep the crate and toys for when you get a puppy at the time of life when you can care for it, and that isn't now.

Stop kidding yourself. He isn't a toy and the fact you played with him yesterday doesn't alter his needs. You can't fulfil his needs. Let him go to someone who can.

When you are ready for another puppy, you will have done your research and won't buy from a puppy farmer again. Just as you are careful buying a house or car, so you must be even more careful buying a life to care for over the next twelve years.

Meantime stay here with us and you will learn so much that will help you when you eventually get your dog.

And I do very much feel for you )))))HUG(((((
A dog is never bad or naughty - it is simply being a dog

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