Multi dog aggression.

[Ejn90]

Hi all,

Not sure where to post this it here I go. I have 3 dogs. Eldest 6, then 5 then 4.

I am currently 38 weeks pregnant and my two youngest have started fighting. The 5 year old is a small patterdale x collie but the youngest is a bull mastiff x so the size difference is noticeable.

They have had two actual fights in the past week and countless interventions. Now the youngest (and biggest) will growl whenever the other walks past. He is particularly bad at night and will growl even louder and head over to him. The other dog will look away and try and avoid contact, the only time he will era t is if I am trapped behind the baby dog.

Anyone had any experience of this? I have had people tell me it will pass when baby is here and that its my hormones etc making them funny however this seems a bit odd to me.

Previous to these fights they would sleep in a heap, all 3 of them squished on top of each other. Now they won't even make eye contact.

[Nettle]

It won't pass, and it will be worse when baby is here. Yes they do know you are pregnant.

We need to know a lot more - about each dog - breed/mix, age, gender, if neutered and at what age, how long you have had each, problems you have had to tackle with any of them, health issues. All about their typical day especially regarding food (what, where, how often?) exercise, training, everything.

Then we can help more.


Well done for coming here because this needs intervention of the right kind.

I will also ask for this to be put in the Training section.

[Ejn90]

Thanks for the reply. How do I move the post?

So... The bigger, younger dog is 4 yo, mastiff x, male unneutered had since roughly 6 months.
The other culprit is a border collie x patterdale, 5 yo, male unneutered had since a pup.

They had a fight about 3 years ago, one off, and we're fine afterwards. They eat freely, I've constant food supply in their crates. They have never been food protective, little one will carry it out the crate and drop it for the others to have etc.

They get a regular walk for about 45 mins in an evening. Usually involves running and everyone lay on the ground so I know they are tired. I also play I that garden with them.

Training - not sure what info you need. They sit, lie down etc on command. They sit for treats, sit when crossing roads, waiting for the ball, before they get a stroke etc.

The eldest dog is 6 and is a German Shepard x collie. He seems unphased by all of it. He's still playful with them both and all of his behaviours have remained the same. When they fight he just looks at them.

[JudyN]

Thanks for the reply. How do I move the post?

You can't, but I've done it for you

[Nettle]

Thanks for the extra info - very helpful is your GSD cross male entire as well? I will have to type this in sections because a fault of the Board is that it times out on long posts, which is really annoying. The issue between your dogs is not to do with gender or them being entire, but may well be that your mastiff type has now reached maturity and is considering throwing his weight around. To be certain, a behaviour trainer used to aggression issues would need to see them - one can only do so much over a keyboard. But we can still help.

First of all I'd recommend a full health profile for ALL the dogs. Very often the first sign of illness is the kind of reactivity you describe. So you need bloods checked for organ function especially a full thyroid check (vets will not perform the full check unless you ask) eyes, ears, mouth/dentition, prostate, skeleton/joints, anything else you can think of.

I would also strongly recommend you cease the free feeding. It does cause tension, even if you don't see any at the time. There is some tension between your youngest dogs, so unless you identify other causes, it makes sense to remove the obvious one. I do understand that you think they are fine, and they could well be, but once you have your baby, tensions will escalate all round, so all potential flashpoints need to be addressed. So feed once or twice a day, with the dogs each separated from each other, and don't leave any food down.

Exercise - they don't do badly, but they are not really getting enough. Can you factor in a morning walk as well so they don't spend all day looking for things to get edgy about?

can you think of any recent changes that have happened in your home or routine?

What other humans and pets share your home?

[Ejn90]

Thanks!

Their whole routine has taken a severe beating. We moved house at Xmas and have been renovating. This has led to their crates getting moved around the house to various locations. It has also meant loss of freedom - before we moved they had the run of downstairs during the day, but because of the situation they have been confined to one room to avoid any injuries. The house is also laid out differently - rather than open it is a lot of separate rooms which means if they want to be able to see us there is less prime real estate to choose from.


When we moved we also stopped them sleeping upstairs in preparation for baby.

My other half - the only other person in the house - has just switched jobs and so is leaving and gettig home at completely different times to what they are used to.

I am a teacher and so have been off for summer and spent the majority of my time with them. So way more than they are used to.

So when you say routine changes I don't think there is anything that has actually remained the same. Sounds horrific really.

[Ejn90]

And GS x is entire yes. Morning walk is difficult - I'm enormous and currently 38 weeks so in the evening both me and my OH take them out. My bending down to pick up balls is a bit rubbish ATM.

Would it work if we took them out at half 2ish then 8? That's something completely possible to arrange.

Thanks

[Nettle]

The walking change that is do-able for you should help.

The upheavals you describe are exactly the sort of situation that cause redirected aggression, so I think you have identified the cause. Now to work on how you can improve matters (as if you haven't had enough upheaval yourself! But at least you know why - they don't). You know what is possible to make your dogs' lives more consistent. they need stability of sleeping area, and places to be that aren't constantly changing. This may be a big extra for you to factor in, but do see what you can do. The root cause of all this friction is insecurity. Truly, most aggression is rooted in insecurity.

[Ejn90]

Thank you!

We moved them back into the front room and they have calmed down. No more fights - still a bit of growling from the youngest but he's the one who is always hit the hardest by everything. They are playing together again now too.

I can still see that there is tension but I can also see they are progressively becoming more comfortable near each other again so it gives me hope.

I don't plan on moving their crates again - and I will simply make sure I don't if that's what they need. I can work around their needs - that's perfectly acceptable - I should have really considered that to begin with but you live and learn.

[Nettle]

Sometimes life throws so much at us we don't think of everything.

I have personally found Bach Flower Remedy Walnut (for life changes) very helpful with my own dogs. Just a few drops in their drinking water each time you change it until things have really calmed down. Incidentally, you need more than one water bowl, and only one with the remedy in, so the dogs can choose.