Two Bitches Fighting

[deb004]

Hi, I really need some help/advice. I have two Border Terriers (boy 3 yrs, neutered and a girl 2 yrs, neutered). I've had them both from pups at 8 weeks old. Both have been to puppy/socialisation/obedience classes. My Sister has come to live with me, she too has 2 Borders (boy 8 yrs, neutered and a Girl 3yrs (my boys sister), neutered). They've also been socialised at puppy/obedience classes etc. The 4 pups have seen lots of each other while growing up, and have always shared everything nicely - toys, beds, food, car crate etc. We all go out walking together every day, and the pups all seemed very happy with each other, no problems at all. None of them seemed to be the dominant one, they all just seemed like equals, with me/my Sister as the leader(s) of the pack.

Everything has been fine for about 7 months while all actually living together (rather than just visiting each other), then suddenly about 3 weeks ago, the girls just hate each other. They fight at every possible opportunity, drawing blood and really hurting each other. There have been 4 fights - the first one, a one-off we thought. Nothing seemed to trigger it, they were out walking and playing, generally having a good time. The second one happened because we weren't ready for it, it was a couple of days after the first, and they had seemed 'friends' again. The third one, human error, someone left a door open and they fought again. The 4th fight was while we were out walking, we were hoping they would sort out who was Top Dog naturally, both were muzzled to avoid any bite injuries, but neither one would back down/give up, so we intervened. We are currently living in separate parts of the house at the moment to keep them apart, so not ideal for any of us. They even bark aggressively at each other through closed doors.

It's heartbreaking and frightening to see them like this, and it is impossible to try and live 'normally' when our whole world has been turned upside down.

Most advice is 'rehome one of them', but we can't believe there isn't anything we can do for them to be friends again, and return our lives to some sort of normality.

Both have been checked at the vets, apart from the bites, both were given a clean bill of health.

The girls have very different personalities - mine is very laid-back and playful, not afraid of anything, my Sisters is a bit barky with other dogs (not my dogs though), and we think this is a bit of insecurity rather than aggression. She is a real lap dog, whereas mine is a bit of a tomboy, although she does snuggle up to me at night. They have human company nearly 24/7 and are rarely left alone. Obviously now, the two girls are never left together at all.

Any help or advice would be very much appreciated.

[Nettle]

I'm sorry - you don't want to hear this.

There is nothing you can do to make them friends again.

It's either rehome one or keep them separate.

Well done for all the actions you have taken so far. You really are star dog owners. Sadly, you have two bitches of the same breed, similar age and terriers as well, and they will continue to fight until one damages the other beyond repair. You don't want that, so the only realistic options are those suggested.

[ClareMarsh]

I don't know if this will help but it's worth reading these two threads from one of our regulars who had b tches fall out.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=15178&p=108344#p108344

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=15436

As you can see they worked hard, with a behaviourist, for some time, but it still led to rehoming one of them.

I guess my only question is do you and your sister intend to live together for the long term. If it's just for a few months or so then maybe you can tolerate managing it, often once we accept something it's easier to deal with. Of course it means everyone has to be very careful all of the time so that no fights can occur. Just a thought.

[gwd]

i'm so sorry you're dealing with this........I know it's heartbreaking.

when b*tches fall out it's ugly.........they hold grudges and don't ever seem to be able to let it go.

I do feel for you........but at this point, management is the course of action.

I applaud you for realizing that right away and taking steps to keep both girls safe. this isn't what you envisioned i'm sure when your sister moved in. .......you have my sympathy.

[Swanny1790]

I'm also sorry, but I agree the only practical option is to keep them apart. If it's any consolation at all, I'm afraid I also have the same sort of issue in my kennel. Chetan and Animosh are sisters, are both absolutely knock-dead gorgeous examples of Hedlund husky females. They came to me at 8 weeks of age and were well socialized and habituated both indoors and out and loved being puppies together, but from the time they hit about 8 months of age or so they developed an extreme distaste for each other. I have to house them on opposite sides of the kennel, I can't run them on the same team together (they'd rather fight than run), can't even walk one near the other's pen or tether without risking an altercation. Both are prefect dolls with every other dog in the kennel but her sister (sigh).

I've not heard of anyone being able to convince two b*tches (or even 2 males) who behave in such a way to 'kiss and make up'. At this point in our understanding of dog behavior it's seems like one of those things we just have to recognize and manage the dog's environment in such a way that they never have an opportunity to 'settle their differences'. A true dog fight (versus a squabble) is truly a fight to the death, and not something any of us are prepared to experience.

[Ari_RR]

Unfortunately, just keeping them apart in the same house will prevent injuries, but wont prevent stress building up in both of them... Which is not good for either one.

I agree with a previous post - if the sister is there short term, management will work.. but if she is there forever, perhaps rehoming is a better choice. As hard as it might be to rehome one of the girls - she may well have a better life in a different place, without a hated enemy in the next room, all the time.

But if this were me, I'd probably try to rehome the sister first

[deb004]

Thanks everyone for taking the time to reply. As my Sister has moved in permanently, we need a long term solution. I can't bear the thought of the inevitable rehoming. My Sister is away at the moment, so we have the house to ourselves - we'll need to have a family meeting when she gets back, to see where we go from here. We all want what's best for the girls at the end of the day, and may have to put our feelings aside. Here's still hoping for a miracle to save the day.

[mum24dog]

Unfortunately, just keeping them apart in the same house will prevent injuries, but wont prevent stress building up in both of them... Which is not good for either one.

I have to agree with this.

I have 2 dogs that fight and they cannot ever be allowed free access to each other. No amount of training or behavioural modification would change the situation. Both are absolutely fine with other dogs.

Neither dog is happy and the smaller one lives in a state of anxiety, so much so that I did find him another home but it didn't work out because he barked too much so he came back and we have to manage it.

Our dogs all bark a lot more than they would if we were able to separate them in a way that meant that none of them has access to the front of the house but we can't.

I had no doubt whatsoever that rehoming was the right decision for all the dogs and humans in the family - I just wish it had worked out. It isn't letting the rehomed dog down or giving up on it, it's the right way to go for the dog's own good.

[gwd]

I had no doubt whatsoever that rehoming was the right decision for all the dogs and humans in the family - I just wish it had worked out. It isn't letting the rehomed dog down or giving up on it, it's the right way to go for the dog's own good.

and as far as deciding which one to rehome.........my suggestion is that the one that goes should be the one that has the most stable, solid temperament. ........pick the one that would most adapt to a change and has the best chance of bonding quickly with a new family.

if you have to chose between one that is confident, bold, outgoing vs one that is insecure, needy, or any other behavour problems..........let the confident one go as it's going to be the one that has the best chance of working out with the new home.