5 mos old pup afraid at dog park! (sorry... Long)

[azeezam]

Hi All,

I have a 5 month old lab/weimaraner puppy. He's currently 55 lbs. He lives with me and my other two dogs, 3 year old female Toy Fox Terriers. They play very well together most of the time, with the puppy occasionally getting too rambunctious. Obviously, he feels confident with them.

Then, he's a different dog when we go to the dog park. I've been taking him there since he was 3 mos and it hasn't really improved.

He's skittish, he scurries/runs away at the first sign of an exhuberent approach from another dog, even if it's done in good natured friendliness. He tries to jump up into my arms or hide between my legs or jump up on the picnic tables. If he doesn't run, he does the belly up thing but not in a way where he's submitting willingly but to where he looks terrified and traumatized. If a dog does get close enough to sniff him, he snaps/bites/yelps defensively into the direction of their face as soon as they get too close or sniff too eagerly. He's a very expressive dog and his face demonstrates that he doesn't feel safe at all.

I've tried calming reassuring voice and words. I've tried ignoring him when he runs to me for protection. I've tried rewarding him/praising him when things are going well. But, even if he starts to make progress, as soon as a friendly game of dog play breaks out near him, he's scared all over again.

One more thing. He seems to be keenly aware of size. His and other dogs. If a dog is smaller than him, he's more likely to remain calm. If a dog is bigger than him, he is scared.

Any advice? I'm really at a loss and worried that he will never learn to enjoy the dog park. He seems to be missing a key piece of doggie play skills that all the other pups I've had came by so naturally. Even though he's had SO MUCH exposure/socialization in his short life.

[Dibbythedog]

That's a shame.
Weimis can be nervy dogs , so perhaps some of this is to do with his genes and also too much exposure can overwhelm a nervy pup and have the oppposite of the desired effect.
I think you should let him gain his confidence by only letting him met small dogs that he feels confident with and quieter big dogs that aren't too boisterous. I would block boisterous dogs approaching and let him watch rough play from a distance where he feels comfortable.
Once he is happier and relaxed you can start to let him meet other dogs.
It's not easy in a park where other dogs run loose so good luck and don't feel bad if you have to block dogs from getting too close.

[Me and my dogs]

I'm new to this forum but loving it already.

Let me take a shot at this....

Hi All,

I have a 5 month old lab/weimaraner puppy. He's currently 55 lbs. He lives with me and my other two dogs, 3 year old female Toy Fox Terriers. They play very well together most of the time, with the puppy occasionally getting too rambunctious. Obviously, he feels confident with them.

Then, he's a different dog when we go to the dog park. I've been taking him there since he was 3 mos and it hasn't really improved.

Before I take any dog into a dog park (and I'm not greatly fond of them) is I make sure the dog going in has a great recall - and it's been tested in various areas and w/ increasing distractions. If it's a dog's first time we go at a low traffic time - usually in the mornings.

Once we are physically at the park and before we go in I watch the behavior of the other dogs in the park. Is there an excessive humper? Is there one dog that seems to be roughing up all the others? I might not go in. This is where I remind people I'm working with that the point of the dog park is for the DOG to get positive socialization - what the human wants is beside the fact. If the dog I'm with is showing any kinds of stress or has never been in I'll walk around the exterior of the dog park and let the dog get used to the sights, sounds, and smells. We might do this for an entire week - maybe more... starting further away from the park if necessary and gradually moving closer.... threshold work.

If and when I go into the park we will wait in the double gated spot before going IN to the park. We wait for the dogs that have rushed the gate to go away. If someone comes in behind me and wants to get in w/ his/her dog then I'll step aside and let them. Let that person's dog take the "bum rush" crowd away from mine.

The entire time I'll watch my dog for any stress - remember - it's not a requirement the dog go in - you can always take a stroll around the park.

When I go in the first thing I do is try to take the dog on a walk of the perimeter. This way my dog is on the move and can see the dogs in the park that are often in a swirl of activity in the center areas of the park. If another dog comes up to meet mine and the sniffing starts I just say something like "good dogs" -(and pay attention to yourself - if you are tense remember to breath normally - how you breath can alert your dog to your stress!) If any thing starts to look tense I move on calmly w/ my dog and let the other dog come too (my new girl seems to have a very limited "sniff" time and does not appreciate sniffs that go on too long)

He's skittish, he scurries/runs away at the first sign of an exhuberent approach from another dog, even if it's done in good natured friendliness. He tries to jump up into my arms or hide between my legs or jump up on the picnic tables. If he doesn't run, he does the belly up thing but not in a way where he's submitting willingly but to where he looks terrified and traumatized. If a dog does get close enough to sniff him, he snaps/bites/yelps defensively into the direction of their face as soon as they get too close or sniff too eagerly. He's a very expressive dog and his face demonstrates that he doesn't feel safe at all.

Okay, maybe I'm misinterpreting "exhuberent approach". Do you mean a really rude greeter that runs straight up to your dog's face and stands very stiff w/ tail straight up while possibly trying to look your dog in the eye?

Hmmmm... let's suppose you walk into a bar and some big guy rushes you coming straight up to you and stares you right in the face while maybe towering over you? Let's say he's got one hand in his coat pocket (I equate the possibility of a weapon in a pocket w/ the possibility of a dog that has a loaded mouth of teeth while standing in an offensive posture). You have the choices of fight or flight. Your dog is confused and tries the doggie version of both. He shows the dog he means no harm, he's belly up to further show it... and, BTW, possibly wondering when you might come in to offer an assist.... you don't come in so now he tries a few quick jabs and makes a get away.

Learn to step in for your dog. Learn when and how and don't let others at the dog park tell you "oh, he'll learn... that's just Big Boy and how he plays." I have stepped in - literally - w/ my legs to move dogs away. I'll walk right thru the middle of them and then turn and either let my dog come to me or tell my dog to sit while I go to it.

I believe that if a dog doesn't believe his owner will step in for him the dog may determine he's on his own and choose an aggressive way to stop being bullied. In other words - some dogs learn to be dog aggressive at dog parks and it comes from owners that either don't know how to recognize what IS play or owners that feel to afraid to stand up for their dogs.

I've tried calming reassuring voice and words. I've tried ignoring him when he runs to me for protection. I've tried rewarding him/praising him when things are going well. But, even if he starts to make progress, as soon as a friendly game of dog play breaks out near him, he's scared all over again.

BTW, if you ever are in that situation in the bar and a good friend shows up and you run to him/her for help and they ignore you - get new friends.

If play breaks out and he runs to you for protection you don't want to stoke and pet the dog but talking to him and laughing and taking a walk w/ the dog in the near vicinity may help your dog. He's not running, you're not coddling, he's still near and can observe the other dogs and he knows his owner isn't abandoning him.

One more thing. He seems to be keenly aware of size. His and other dogs. If a dog is smaller than him, he's more likely to remain calm. If a dog is bigger than him, he is scared.

Well, makes sense. He does need to get used to diffrent breeds and sizes. Doesn't mean he has to like them or play with them all.

Part of that, of course can be he's not used to being around large dogs - so just walking w/ him around the outside - exterior of the fencing - of the dog park could help him get used to it... threshold to getting closer. Just going into the park and sort of thrusting him into the large dog play is like flooding.

Additionally, and perhaps quite importantly, different breeds have different styles of play! I like the herders. Play consists of a lot of chase and some occasional jaw sparring - yes there will be attempts to nip- they are herders! They also have cut off signals that are politely read and play ceases. Bully breeds are a lot of constant face interaction and rough and tumble play - which can really piss a herder off, btw as I believe it musses their fur - and bully breeds don't seem to have cut off signals. I believe there are a few DVD's on this topic.

I hope this isn't a rule violation (Good doG this is just my 2nd post!) but this website has some good stuff on dog parks and, I believe, breed differences/tendencies.

http://www.positivelytrained.com/edu_resources.php[/b][/quote]

[ShannonO]

I would disagree on the generalization of bully breeds. I COMPLETELY agree that dogs have different styles of play. You can set some expectations based on breed, but not all.

My bully (American Bulldog) will wrestle with the rest of them, but at the dog park he wanted to play "tag your it" and chase all the time.

We have since stopped going to the park completely...too many people make too many assumptions about my dog because he's a blocky, stocky while dog that everyone takes for a pitt.