thanks to the last few posts. this is really hard and I appreciate the support.
just really quick about my husband, his work schedule is a 12 hours shift, so when he gets home he eats, showers and goes right to bed, so it's pretty much impossible for him to help.
about a month or two ago I took Biff out to try some of the walking techniques I saw Victoria doing on her show. he was doing fine, until our neighbors let out their little yappy dogs. it's hard when the environment is not good for his learning. also, I gave up due to my other dog in the window freaking out because he could see us. unfortunately he doesn't fit into Biff's crate. so if I do anything I will have to wait for my husband to come home to distract him during dinner or something. I even bought a bag of small treats to reward him with during the training.
we are behind on bills right now, but as soon as I save up some money I will buy a clicker and another harness.
desperate for help...
Moderators: emmabeth, BoardHost
Re: desperate for help...
I'm sorry but I have to disagree with this as I worked 12 hour shifts for the first 6 years I owned Rupert. Unfortunately it's a matter of making time to meet the dogs needs no matter how knackered you are after a shift.just really quick about my husband, his work schedule is a 12 hours shift, so when he gets home he eats, showers and goes right to bed, so it's pretty much impossible for him to help.
Re: desperate for help...
Right, you need to break this stuff down into manageable chunks.
As the others have said, all this stuff is lack of exercise/not managing him properly - change a few things and it will start to slot into place.
First thing though, YOUR attitude is crucial in all of this - so far ive skimmed through this thread and I have seen from you, loads of reasons why you cant do this, you couldnt do that, you stopped doing the other.
Stop.
Forget why you cant, or wont or dont want to or gave up.... move on. You HAVE to be positive, positive dog training isnt just about the dog! Its about you too!
Soooo.. Your dog is bored witless and finding his own fun. Hes a big dog bred to do a lot of work and you need to find a way to do that. Your hubby CAN help - 12 hour shifts ARE hard but theres another 12 hours to his day and he ain't sleepin for all of them. He can find 30 minutes from somewhere or even 15 minutes, at either end of the day.
Food - no more food in a bowl for him. He wants to eat, he works for it. Find that Kong, fill it with kibble, pour a little low-salt gravy or stock over it, freeze it. When pay day comes around, buy a few more kongs (there are other toys that work in a similar way that are cheaper, get those).
The rest of his food, hide it in twists of newspaper, put those in a cardboard box, put that in a bigger box and put more twists of paper with food in them in there (make sure theres no staples). Give him that in a room away from your other dog so there will be no fights or arguing.
IF hes the type (and since you do have another dog) to think 'heyyyyy i want something in a bowl' you can reserve a few pieces of kibble and maybe some bits of chopped up carrot or something and give him those in a bowl at meal times so he THINKS hes still getting a full dinner and doesnt whine or nag for it.
The rest of his food you use as training treats - mix these up with pieces of hard cheese, hot dog sausage etc so that its a bit of a lucky dip and hes always working super hard in case THIS time, its something awesome.
I am sure you can devise other ways of having him work hard for his food doing fun stuff. Yes, it IS gonna make a mess for you to clear up - better this than the mess of him having trashed your stuff.
Training - since he now has to work to get his food, you need to do several training sessions a day. These need only be a few minutes at a time (and in fact are BETTER if they are short). You dont need a clicker - got a pen that clicks? Got a jar lid with the security seal dent on it, use those. (And if you do want to get a clicker they are a few £/$, really cheap).
The first few sessions teaching him waht the clicker means will be super easy anyway - go in a room with him and without your other dog. Put some of his kibble/treats in a pot beside you on the table and sit there and go 'click' - treat - 'click'- treat over and over until all the traets are gone. Dont talk to him particularly (you dont hae to stay silent but dont chatter away or you will confuse him). Just do this for a few minutes at a time until he begins to get the idea that the click sound means you are about to give him a treat.
If he gets giddy and stupid, use a time out - that is, you step out of the room, shut the door, count ten, return. (I say you go out of the room as i reckon trying to put him out of the room would be WAY too exciting right now and wont help). When you do this, SAY NOTHING,just get up, take the clicker and treats with you, leave, wait, return.
You WILL have to repeat the time out over and over until he gets the message. If you quit after the first two or three and say 'oh it doesnt work' you will actually make his behaviour WORSE because he will have learned if he tries really hard for a long time, you WILL reward him, so its worth doing. So stay strong! Do not make the time out longer, thats not helpful at all. Just the count of ten!
Once he understand what the clicker means you can use it to mark the split second (its kinda like taking a photo of the exact behaviour you wanted) he did the right thing and reward him. This way it doesnt matter if he ONLY did the right thing for that split second, you 'caught it' with the clicker, marked it and rewarded it and hes going to start remembering what it was he was doign when you clicked.. adn trying to do it again!
Walks - use whatever you have for now, but ideally a harness and a head collar would be best, so put those on your list for pay day. Practice him not pulling in the yard, on the lead (heck practice him walking to heel OFF lead in the yard, using the clicker and treats once he understands what teh clicker means!!).
Practice putting the lead on and him sitting calmly. Again you can use the time outs here and if your time outs are the right length he doesnt have TIME to be eating the lead. If he has the time to chew the lead off, then hes been left too long and the time out wasnt effective.
Once you get out the door, JUST practice for five or ten minutes, the loose lead method in our articles section (also linked n the useful links thread stickied at the top of this forum) - about turn and march the other way BEFORE he pulls that leash tight, if you wait for him to already be pulling you it teaches him nothing.
Your husband can also find ten minutes to do a short training walk like this, if he can do two a day and you can do two a day, of ten minutes each, thats forty minutes hard mental exercise your dog is getting!
For letting him out in the yard, Id put a trailing line on him, cheap length of plastic washing line, so that you can take that up at a distance and he CANNOT blow you offwhen you say its time to come in.
As the others have said, all this stuff is lack of exercise/not managing him properly - change a few things and it will start to slot into place.
First thing though, YOUR attitude is crucial in all of this - so far ive skimmed through this thread and I have seen from you, loads of reasons why you cant do this, you couldnt do that, you stopped doing the other.
Stop.
Forget why you cant, or wont or dont want to or gave up.... move on. You HAVE to be positive, positive dog training isnt just about the dog! Its about you too!
Soooo.. Your dog is bored witless and finding his own fun. Hes a big dog bred to do a lot of work and you need to find a way to do that. Your hubby CAN help - 12 hour shifts ARE hard but theres another 12 hours to his day and he ain't sleepin for all of them. He can find 30 minutes from somewhere or even 15 minutes, at either end of the day.
Food - no more food in a bowl for him. He wants to eat, he works for it. Find that Kong, fill it with kibble, pour a little low-salt gravy or stock over it, freeze it. When pay day comes around, buy a few more kongs (there are other toys that work in a similar way that are cheaper, get those).
The rest of his food, hide it in twists of newspaper, put those in a cardboard box, put that in a bigger box and put more twists of paper with food in them in there (make sure theres no staples). Give him that in a room away from your other dog so there will be no fights or arguing.
IF hes the type (and since you do have another dog) to think 'heyyyyy i want something in a bowl' you can reserve a few pieces of kibble and maybe some bits of chopped up carrot or something and give him those in a bowl at meal times so he THINKS hes still getting a full dinner and doesnt whine or nag for it.
The rest of his food you use as training treats - mix these up with pieces of hard cheese, hot dog sausage etc so that its a bit of a lucky dip and hes always working super hard in case THIS time, its something awesome.
I am sure you can devise other ways of having him work hard for his food doing fun stuff. Yes, it IS gonna make a mess for you to clear up - better this than the mess of him having trashed your stuff.
Training - since he now has to work to get his food, you need to do several training sessions a day. These need only be a few minutes at a time (and in fact are BETTER if they are short). You dont need a clicker - got a pen that clicks? Got a jar lid with the security seal dent on it, use those. (And if you do want to get a clicker they are a few £/$, really cheap).
The first few sessions teaching him waht the clicker means will be super easy anyway - go in a room with him and without your other dog. Put some of his kibble/treats in a pot beside you on the table and sit there and go 'click' - treat - 'click'- treat over and over until all the traets are gone. Dont talk to him particularly (you dont hae to stay silent but dont chatter away or you will confuse him). Just do this for a few minutes at a time until he begins to get the idea that the click sound means you are about to give him a treat.
If he gets giddy and stupid, use a time out - that is, you step out of the room, shut the door, count ten, return. (I say you go out of the room as i reckon trying to put him out of the room would be WAY too exciting right now and wont help). When you do this, SAY NOTHING,just get up, take the clicker and treats with you, leave, wait, return.
You WILL have to repeat the time out over and over until he gets the message. If you quit after the first two or three and say 'oh it doesnt work' you will actually make his behaviour WORSE because he will have learned if he tries really hard for a long time, you WILL reward him, so its worth doing. So stay strong! Do not make the time out longer, thats not helpful at all. Just the count of ten!
Once he understand what the clicker means you can use it to mark the split second (its kinda like taking a photo of the exact behaviour you wanted) he did the right thing and reward him. This way it doesnt matter if he ONLY did the right thing for that split second, you 'caught it' with the clicker, marked it and rewarded it and hes going to start remembering what it was he was doign when you clicked.. adn trying to do it again!
Walks - use whatever you have for now, but ideally a harness and a head collar would be best, so put those on your list for pay day. Practice him not pulling in the yard, on the lead (heck practice him walking to heel OFF lead in the yard, using the clicker and treats once he understands what teh clicker means!!).
Practice putting the lead on and him sitting calmly. Again you can use the time outs here and if your time outs are the right length he doesnt have TIME to be eating the lead. If he has the time to chew the lead off, then hes been left too long and the time out wasnt effective.
Once you get out the door, JUST practice for five or ten minutes, the loose lead method in our articles section (also linked n the useful links thread stickied at the top of this forum) - about turn and march the other way BEFORE he pulls that leash tight, if you wait for him to already be pulling you it teaches him nothing.
Your husband can also find ten minutes to do a short training walk like this, if he can do two a day and you can do two a day, of ten minutes each, thats forty minutes hard mental exercise your dog is getting!
For letting him out in the yard, Id put a trailing line on him, cheap length of plastic washing line, so that you can take that up at a distance and he CANNOT blow you offwhen you say its time to come in.
West Midlands based 1-2-1 Training & Behaviour Canine Consultant
Re: desperate for help...
My pup was introduced to my cats from when she was first brought into the house at 13 weeks old, so she has always known them in the house, and is used to them being around. She doesn't see them as prey, but she does see them as playmates. I think the most important thing for mine is that they have somewhere to escape to so they feel safe from annoying dogginess. The two boy cats can both jump up ontop of my 1.5m high bookshelves when they want to be out of her way. The smaller (and quite odd) girl cat can't or won't jump very high, however, so we got one of those scratching pole combo things. This one has a box with a hole at the bottom that we've put near a wall so only she can squeeze inside and it's like a safe den for her. She mostly uses it to combat the hoover!
Pup USED to want to destroy things like the scratching poles, but as she grew up more she's learned what she is allowed to chew and what she's not. Make sure he has some things he IS allowed to chew so you can substitute them in if he starts getting interested in something he's not allowed to have. This doesn't have to be anything expensive - my local butchers gives away free bones, or you can use empty cardboard boxes (no staples) or toilet rolls stuffed with tasty things that he can rip up.
She very occasionally wants to give chase, but 2 of the 3 have learned not to run, so that doesn't really happen anymore. The 3rd stays out of her way mostly, but I can see her go into that frozen 'hunting' pose when she wants to do it, and distract her. Perhaps once you get a harness you can leave that on with a long lead trailing behind so you can pickup the lead if he starts to chase.
I don't ever leave pup at home alone with the cats - she always gets shut in a different room.
Also - you don't have to buy a clicker! You can just use a word - I use "YES" instead of the 'click' noise - but you could also use a pen that has a clicky top, or the lid of a jar that 'pops' (do you know the type I mean?). I'm not sure if you mentioned what country you're in - but here in the UK we have a group called Freecycle (or I think it's Freegle now) where people give away old things they don't want for free, or ask for things they need, etc. I see quite a few doggy things pop up on my local one, it might be worth a look.
This is the cat-scratching stand with the box-den at the bottom (hole is facing the bench)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/minkee/564 ... 2089556873
And this is the bookshelves they can jump upto. They often sleep on the orange blanket.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/minkee/443 ... 2089556873
Pup USED to want to destroy things like the scratching poles, but as she grew up more she's learned what she is allowed to chew and what she's not. Make sure he has some things he IS allowed to chew so you can substitute them in if he starts getting interested in something he's not allowed to have. This doesn't have to be anything expensive - my local butchers gives away free bones, or you can use empty cardboard boxes (no staples) or toilet rolls stuffed with tasty things that he can rip up.
She very occasionally wants to give chase, but 2 of the 3 have learned not to run, so that doesn't really happen anymore. The 3rd stays out of her way mostly, but I can see her go into that frozen 'hunting' pose when she wants to do it, and distract her. Perhaps once you get a harness you can leave that on with a long lead trailing behind so you can pickup the lead if he starts to chase.
I don't ever leave pup at home alone with the cats - she always gets shut in a different room.
Also - you don't have to buy a clicker! You can just use a word - I use "YES" instead of the 'click' noise - but you could also use a pen that has a clicky top, or the lid of a jar that 'pops' (do you know the type I mean?). I'm not sure if you mentioned what country you're in - but here in the UK we have a group called Freecycle (or I think it's Freegle now) where people give away old things they don't want for free, or ask for things they need, etc. I see quite a few doggy things pop up on my local one, it might be worth a look.
This is the cat-scratching stand with the box-den at the bottom (hole is facing the bench)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/minkee/564 ... 2089556873
And this is the bookshelves they can jump upto. They often sleep on the orange blanket.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/minkee/443 ... 2089556873
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liddybuck01
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2011 1:17 am
Re: desperate for help...
the cat we have that he doesn't bother was here when we got him. the other cat who he is obsessed with we got after we already had Biff, and the cat's reactions are probably what started it all, but as you know, cats aren't as trainable as dogs lol
as for my husband, I know to you guys it sounds like he has time, but I swear to you he doesn't. he is a musician and he doesn't even have time for that anymore. hell, I barely see him, honestly. espcially when he is on midnight shift. when we get caught up on bills he will cut back on working 7 days a week to just 5. then I will have him help me, but it not going to be right now.
I've started praising him more today when he comes in when I've been calling him in, giving a treat when he does and lots of good boy talk. so far so good. it's just at night that's the problem, but I think I will just continue to hook him on the line we have set up for that.
as for my husband, I know to you guys it sounds like he has time, but I swear to you he doesn't. he is a musician and he doesn't even have time for that anymore. hell, I barely see him, honestly. espcially when he is on midnight shift. when we get caught up on bills he will cut back on working 7 days a week to just 5. then I will have him help me, but it not going to be right now.
I've started praising him more today when he comes in when I've been calling him in, giving a treat when he does and lots of good boy talk. so far so good. it's just at night that's the problem, but I think I will just continue to hook him on the line we have set up for that.
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nightsrainfall
- Posts: 331
- Joined: Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:08 pm
- Location: USA
Re: desperate for help...
If you really want to rehome him - then I'm going to respond to that.
You can easily call the local rescues and shelters. I volunteered at my last locations animal shelter and Malamutes & Husky's were almost always adopted or we sent them to a special rescue if they had a lot of "issues". I can understand the term 'devil' dog for a malamute/husky (said in love of course) - when those dogs get bored... oh boy it's a whole lotta "fun, uh-huh really-really 'fun'.
lol. I think they are pretty smart for all the trouble they can get into.
These dogs need a lot of exercise. We use to always get them in over the winter because the winter was such a lot of people couldn't go outside as far, they would escape and go forever-and-ever-and-ever. We had one we called "out-of-town-er", cause he was from the town over and no one knew why he always came to our town!
Anyway, if you contact the rescues and shelters, sometimes they will tell you what they do with the dogs, if they have a list (we always had a list) of adopters who were looking for a specific dog, breed, or whatever, or you could put the dog up for adoption and state you'd foster him until he's adopted (some will let you do this, some won't).
I've volunteered at 2 shelters so far, one good (really good), one not so good. Talking to them, if you are thinking of rehoming him, may help.
(I'm not saying you SHOULD rehome him, only talking If you believe you want to or if you are considering - rehoming is your choice not mine. I think doing our best for the dog, trying our best, and trying to achieve what the dog needs is always important.)
You can easily call the local rescues and shelters. I volunteered at my last locations animal shelter and Malamutes & Husky's were almost always adopted or we sent them to a special rescue if they had a lot of "issues". I can understand the term 'devil' dog for a malamute/husky (said in love of course) - when those dogs get bored... oh boy it's a whole lotta "fun, uh-huh really-really 'fun'.
lol. I think they are pretty smart for all the trouble they can get into. These dogs need a lot of exercise. We use to always get them in over the winter because the winter was such a lot of people couldn't go outside as far, they would escape and go forever-and-ever-and-ever. We had one we called "out-of-town-er", cause he was from the town over and no one knew why he always came to our town!
Anyway, if you contact the rescues and shelters, sometimes they will tell you what they do with the dogs, if they have a list (we always had a list) of adopters who were looking for a specific dog, breed, or whatever, or you could put the dog up for adoption and state you'd foster him until he's adopted (some will let you do this, some won't).
I've volunteered at 2 shelters so far, one good (really good), one not so good. Talking to them, if you are thinking of rehoming him, may help.
(I'm not saying you SHOULD rehome him, only talking If you believe you want to or if you are considering - rehoming is your choice not mine. I think doing our best for the dog, trying our best, and trying to achieve what the dog needs is always important.)
- Anna
"Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole."
~ Roger A. Caras
"Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole."
~ Roger A. Caras
Re: desperate for help...
Wow- he is a BEAUTIFUL boy!! You sound like you have your hands full. I won't tell you what to do, you love your dog, but you aren't a bad person if you have to rehome him. He is gorgeous.
Maybe there's someone out there who is looking for an active dog who would also let you visit him?
Maybe there's someone out there who is looking for an active dog who would also let you visit him?
Re: desperate for help...
Hi,
I am not a dog expert/trainer but I have a siberian husky and a husky x malamute, both rescue dogs. They are a very unique breed that require understanding in order to get the best out of them. Firstly you are lucky that he just "bothers" one of your cats, as huskies have a high predatory drive. As everyone has said they need LOTS of exercise. My fiance and I both work full time but make time to walk or run the dogs for a minimum of 1.5-2hours daily, even if that means in the dark whilst half asleep. The pair of them love to spend the rest of the day lazing around. On the odd days they dont have a long run, they cause mischief.....but that is our fault not theirs! We were recommended to feed them 3 small meals a day as huskies are a resourceful breed and do not require large meals unless they are sledge pulling for hours on end! The husky x malamute does pull on the lead but we are dedicated to correcting/training her on every walk, even at 6am! It frustrates me that you say you are struggling to pay bills and cannot afford to help your dog at this time with training and toys etc. Why put yourself in this situation?! I would love another dog but am aware at the moment we cannot afford it.
The rescue centre, where we got our husky x malamute from, specialises in the breed as too many people take the breed on without researching the commitment. One of the main organisers has 2 malamutes whom are huge. She walks them single handedly with the use of a walking belt........which could help you. The rescue is called Huskies In Need but is UK based but they may know of a US alternative for you if that is what you chose.
Sorry if this response seems a little pointed but being a rescue husky owner I know they get a bad reputation from owners who do not put in the time to get the really loving, wonderful soppy side out of them.
Jen
I am not a dog expert/trainer but I have a siberian husky and a husky x malamute, both rescue dogs. They are a very unique breed that require understanding in order to get the best out of them. Firstly you are lucky that he just "bothers" one of your cats, as huskies have a high predatory drive. As everyone has said they need LOTS of exercise. My fiance and I both work full time but make time to walk or run the dogs for a minimum of 1.5-2hours daily, even if that means in the dark whilst half asleep. The pair of them love to spend the rest of the day lazing around. On the odd days they dont have a long run, they cause mischief.....but that is our fault not theirs! We were recommended to feed them 3 small meals a day as huskies are a resourceful breed and do not require large meals unless they are sledge pulling for hours on end! The husky x malamute does pull on the lead but we are dedicated to correcting/training her on every walk, even at 6am! It frustrates me that you say you are struggling to pay bills and cannot afford to help your dog at this time with training and toys etc. Why put yourself in this situation?! I would love another dog but am aware at the moment we cannot afford it.
The rescue centre, where we got our husky x malamute from, specialises in the breed as too many people take the breed on without researching the commitment. One of the main organisers has 2 malamutes whom are huge. She walks them single handedly with the use of a walking belt........which could help you. The rescue is called Huskies In Need but is UK based but they may know of a US alternative for you if that is what you chose.
Sorry if this response seems a little pointed but being a rescue husky owner I know they get a bad reputation from owners who do not put in the time to get the really loving, wonderful soppy side out of them.
Jen
