Murphy...a role model??

[Noobs]

The temps have been reaching 100F (37C) lately so yesterday I waited until after 8:00 to walk Murph. Seems like a different set of people/dogs were out. There were two owners at a corner a couple of blocks from our house struggling with a greeting, mostly because one of the dogs was a 4-month old pup (looked like he could have been one of Dixie's!) who had no leash manners to speak of; the other was a 2-year-old chihuahua. Murphy looked like he wanted to go see them - he was looking toward them, body relaxed, sniffing the air and tail wagging, hackles not up, and glanced at me once or twice - and both owners looked at us and didn't protest, so we walked over and I asked Murphy to sit before he could greet the dogs.

I wanted to make sure that the little hound pup was settled enough to do a calm greeting so I kept Murphy waiting, bless him, as he sat there, looking at the dog with his tail wagging. By this time the chi owner picked up her dog because he was having a hard time with all the excitement. Just then 6 teenagers walked by, 3 on one side of Murphy, 3 on the other, and he stayed in his spot! When they passed, he got up to greet the dog, and I said calmly, "Murphy, wait," and he sat back down! The two owners started asking me how old he was, did I take him to obedience class, and saying how good he was! Finally the hound pup settled down a little and walked toward Murphy, Murphy looked up at me and I said "okay" and they did a proper greeting - sideways, sniffing behinds, no excitement! I called Murphy back to me saying "Okay, enough," and he went back to my side but kept looking at the dog - he didn't sit unless I asked him to, which was fine, as long as he was by my side and not charging anyone. It was actually the pup who was - as a pup would - trying to charge him. The owner, who seemed like a lovely person, sadly was trying to calm the pup down by alpha rolling him. She pushed him onto his back and held him by the neck and by the hind legs, and while the pup lay there whale-eyed, she let the other owner put her chi on the ground so he could sniff his behind. It was really difficult for me to keep from saying anything, because you can sort of tell when someone is going to be receptive or defensive, and I didn't want to alienate her -- and I have to add, I didn't want to get into a confrontation while Murphy was being so calm and well-behaved. But the three of us chatted for a few minutes, and the two ladies kept telling me how good Murphy was and what did I do? So I said that I trained him myself with positive training (hoping that would sink in). Murphy would sit on either my verbal cue or a hand signal, and the lady with the hound pup repeatedly said "Sit" in an angry tone and pushing her dog's backside down. At one point she was pulling his front legs out from under him, trying to get him to lie down (which he wouldn't, he just kept getting back up into sit position), and she kept saying "down...down...down...down..." and after a while Murphy lay down! They both thought that was hilarious, and so did I.

At one point an old woman wearing one of those fabric hats on her head approached and she was sort of eyeing the dogs. I could see Murphy get alert and try to look at her past the other dogs, so mid-sentence I stopped chatting and said, "One second..." and took him behind a car. After the old lady passed, we came back and Murphy was fine again. Crisis averted!

We chatted a few more minutes, during which time the chi owner said she couldn't take her lab/pit on walks because he pulled so much and wanted to know how I taught Murphy to walk nicely on leash. So I showed them Mattie's loose leash walking method on Murphy so they were both excited to try it. I made sure to tell them to add distractions slowly, etc. etc.

So look at that! My boy was a good role model last night! I was very proud, and I gave him extra nice treats during our clicker training session before bed.

P.S. I am feeling guilty about not saying anything to the hound owner about the alpha rolls, but I didn't know how to approach it without sounding like a know-it-all or a busybody or like I was interferring. It's a sensitive subject, like seeing someone discipline their child in public, there's little you can do without making yourself a target. And honestly I was more worried about maintaining Murphy's calmness.

[maximoo]

GOOD BOY MURPHY!!!!!! GiVE THAT BOY LOTS OF BELLY RUBS & HEINY SCRATCHES FOR ME!
And pat yourself on the back for your persistance & consistancy in training him. Very well done!

I know how hard it was for you not to say anything about how badly the hound pup was being treated. However, perhaps next time you see such a scenario you can relay that you used to use those methods & they never worked then you switched to positive & have much better results (while Murph sits quiet & proud) So essentially you aren't coming off as a know-it-all but someone who struggled at one time too. All you are doing is recapping what you did, it didn't work & now these methods work much better. Its not preaching or trying to force your opinion on them. Nothing offensive there. If they do get defensive just chg the subject & bid them good luck. This way you'll never keep thinking that you should've spoke up (on the dog's behalf) You might see them again if you walk Murph at the same time, same place & you'll get to tell your story.

There will be many more days of good walks with your boy. Keep up the good work!

[Fundog]

Absolutely. Ditto everything maximoo said!

[Mattie]

WOW Noobs, what a long way you have both come, congratulations.

[josie1918]

Is'nt it wonderful when the results of all that hard work start to shine through Good job Murphy, and parents!!!

[Sabrina]

Wow, you and Murphy are both role models in my book! I was really impressed by how in tune you were with Murphy --- stories like yours are really helping me as I work with my little Charley.

P.S. I am feeling guilty about not saying anything to the hound owner about the alpha rolls, but I didn't know how to approach it without sounding like a know-it-all or a busybody or like I was interferring. It's a sensitive subject, like seeing someone discipline their child in public, there's little you can do without making yourself a target. And honestly I was more worried about maintaining Murphy's calmness.

I don't think you should feel guilty at all. That owner could see how good your relationship with Murphy is and how the positive methods really work (and punishment doesn't) . Your focus was on Murphy and that's why he was able to maintain his calmness. Charley and I have had some bad experiences on walks when I didn't put his needs first. So you are an inspiration to me!!!

[jacksdad]

wooohooo...way to go Noobs and Murphy.

I hear you on the alpha roll thing, but you were right to keep your priority Murphy. besides sometime a picture or actions speak louder then words. hopefully it will click and they will wonder a bit more down the road what this "positive reinforcement thing is all about...seem to work really well on that Murphy dog"

[emmabeth]

Brilliant!

And dont feel bad about not having said anything about the alpha roll stuff - lead by example.

In your shoes, i probably would have gone off on one, alienated them, they woul dhave forgotten how nicely behaved my dog was and jus remembered the mad ranty woman.

Your way was infinitely better!

[Noobs]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone!

You're right, I am just going to hope I see that lady and her lovely pup again, and that we can chat more and I can influence her rather than lecture her.

[bmbutler]

I know you are very proud!

[Noobs]

Update! I ran into the lady (alpha roller) with the hound puppy a couple of weeks ago!

I was at a drug store waiting for a prescription and she showed up with her husband and her lovely little dog who was about 4 1/2 months old by that time. We weren't sure if dogs were allowed in there or not, but the pharmacist was saying "Cute dog" and no one asked them to take him out, so yay? The dog went straight for me and as I didn't have Murphy with me I was able to give him my full attention. He was very mouthy and I was letting him play with my hands. I was impressed at how soft his mouth was; he didn't hurt me at all. I told her as much and she was thankful to hear it. She said she never let him get to her hands nearly as much as I was. Every time he tried to jump on me I stood up, waited until he had "four on the floor" and gave him praise. It only took a few reps for him to stand in front of me without jumping. Unfortunately she was also yanking him and saying "Nooooo, nooooo..." which of course wasn't helping. I told her, "It's ok, I'll just stand up when he jumps," but it's tough to get out of a habit like that, so she never stopped yanking him when he tried to jump.

At one point I stood up and let the dog continue to mouth my hands. Every time he tried to jump, I straighted up and turned my back, and he I suppose instinctively sat down. If he happened to get too excited and bite down too hard, I squealed quietly (so as not to rile him up furhter) and straightened up and turned my back as well. I would turn back toward him and continue to let him play with my hands whenever he had all four paws on the floor or if he paused like "whaa--?" L heard her whisper to her husband, "Hey, we should do that, turn our backs." (Yes! Little victories!) What's unfortunate is that the husband was accidentally reinforcing the jumping as every time the dog jumped on him, he would pet him then back up to make him get off. Dog jumps, dad pets him, backs up and dog is back on the floor...lather, rinse, repeat. So it may take some time for them to get it right. The dog will of course get confused, but I hope that they find the right methods and find a way to be consistent. The dog is really a lovely pup and they were so nice to let me keep playing with him so I'm hoping for the best.

[Dixies momma]

high praise for u and murphy. he def deserved extra treat rewards ie belly rubs etc. i see your point on not wanting cause conflict with trying to tell her best way to train the pup. when asked i try my best to explain what i do. and i def talk victoria up to people by telling them i watched her show and learned a great deal. shoot one day my bf was in the kitchen with a cracker and dixie wanted one. all of a sudden she sat without being asked to and he looked at me and said i got her well trained to sit for treats. lol then he remembered the touch and five commands i did with her and he tried it with her and she did well for his first try working with her.anyhow. i am off to cut more grass, its just too hot but gotta be done. so keep trying to work with that lady as much as she will allow when u see her again. wonderful story about murphys progress

[Noobs]

Thanks! And sometimes the significant others are harder to train than the dogs, so good for you and your bf!

[leslie123]

Thanks for sharing this experience. We have some neighbors very similar and I hope our little Sulley grows into "role model" status as well. I'll be anxious to hear how things develop with your neighbor!