Does anyone Know if Victoria adopts troubled dogs?

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m8r5k
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Does anyone Know if Victoria adopts troubled dogs?

Post by m8r5k »

Does anyone know if Victoria has adopted any troubled dogs . I am getting desperate to save my boy. I bought this dog with the hopes of it becoming a therapy dog for abused foster children, at my mothers house. Also to help get me out of the house. I feel A lot of anxiety when around people. I was hoping if I had a dog I'd have to get out to walk him. Unfortunately, now instead of being afraid of people I'm afraid my dogs going to bite someone. I've made progress getting him around people. Just not enough.
I didn't know much about dogs and bought a 5 week old puppy, who even with tons of socialization won't let strangers near him. I keep my curtains closed and walk him at night or on days when not too many people are out. I have tried to re home him on petfinder, but I keep turning people down. I feel they are not qualified enough to deal with his issues. I love my dog and don't want to give him up. I also don't want him to be put down. All the American Rescues are full right now. I have even emailed the monks of new skeet asking for $300 to hire a trainer who guarantees she can fix him. As my 3 year old gets older and wants to have friends over, I know there are going to be problems.
I want to ask Victoria if she could adopt my dog. I don't think I'd trust anyone else. You can see his ad as well as some you tube videos to get a better idea about the side of him I see.
Please nobody bad mouth me about giving up too soon. I have worked tirelessly for a year trying to help him. The stress of caring for him has given me high blood pressure, as well as migraines. I have read nearly every book in the library on dog training, as well as begging trainers in my area for help. I have considered debarking. I have an appt for a consultation, but I'm not sure how I feel about the health risk involved.
Even saving money for a trainer isn't an option. We get the same amount of money every 3 months and are always about $700 short by the end of the term. In 2 years, when my husband graduates, we should have plenty. I know my dogs problems will be worse by then.
I just want to save my dog. I know Victoria would love him. He is so soft, and extremely smart. He learns tricks in 10 minutes tops. His breed also doesn't have a doggy oder. There fur is self cleaning too. He is good about noises and with other dogs, so maybe he could even go along with her as she travels around.

http://www.petfinder.com/petnote/displa ... d=12915330

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJQlLX-6 ... annel_page

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8hkG9k3 ... annel_page
Is a dogs life worth my own? I wish I knew.
Fundog
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Post by Fundog »

I won't badmouth you at all. Your motive was pure, and while the plan backfired, your reasoning was still understandable. Have you tried to get therapy for your own anxiety? Your dog can sense that you are anxious, and that might be contributing to his problems. Your best bet is to get an adult dog that is already trained and certified for therapy-- or actually, the best thing would be to find someone who has a certified therapy dog, and have that person bring his/her dog to visit you and take you for walks and other outings. After you become more comfortable outside the home and among other people, then you could consider getting a dog of your own again.

I realise this advice doesn't really apply to rehoming the dog you have, but it could still be helpful to you, and prevent having to rehome another in the future.

Also, have you tried Best Friends Animal Sanctuary, in Kanab, Utah? They are a no-kill shelter, and while they rehabilitate and re-home animals (they take all kinds, including birds and horses) that are eligible, they also have many who will spend the rest of their lives at this sanctuary. The animals receive the best veterinary care available, and training, socialization, fostering when ready to live in a home again, careful evaluation to find the best people match, etc. The sanctuary is now filmed on the National Geographic Channel, titled "Dogtown." (BTW, Best Friends is one of the shelters involved in taking the Pit Bulls from the Michael Vick case). Like most rescues, they also require an adoption application and a home study, etc. to ensure the best possible match for any pet they adopt out.
m8r5k
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Thank you

Post by m8r5k »

Thank you for your advice. I will check out there web page. I did here about a place at my nearest community outreach that will train dogs for low income families. They also provide mental help. However, I have social issues I'm not retarded like the free mental heath people treat me. I used to have a nice house, clothes, stuff. Things have just been hard since my husband started school full time.
emmabeth
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Post by emmabeth »

Ok - can you tell us more about your dogs problems?

I can appreciate (from personal experience) some of the problems you have/are dealing with yourself, but maybe if we can outline what needs to be done with your dog, you could tackle it.

Right now you seem to be floundering about for help, and not knowing where to turn or who to ask. (Monks of new skeet... their dog training ideas have caused dogs a LOT of problems!)

Unfortunately Victoria has a rescue dog and a young family so is highly unlikely to be able to take on your dog, obviously I cannot speak for her but realistically its not something to pin your hopes on.

However some of the people who post on here are experienced dog trainers and behaviourists and their advice could well give you an idea of what you need to do.
m8r5k
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Help for my Koda

Post by m8r5k »

I've talked to so many trainers as well as spending hours online. I just feel like I'm running out of time. I know that fearful dogs become aggressive if not treated soon enough. I think Koda is making the transition. He just doesn't trust strangers. After an entire year of hard work I can walk him around outside, but if there is a child or someone speaks to him or tries to touch him he backs up and starts barking. Lately he is backing off less, and moving forward more often. Not in a good way. The employees at petco can give him a treat while he is calm (tossing it). When the treat is gone he goes nuts with the barking again. If I have company over he barks the entire time. I once had my mother over and he barked 3 hours strait. I have tried sending him to my room for time outs. He saw this as a relief, not a punishment, and didn't sop barking anyway. I have also tried hooking him to a leash in the living room and only removing him when he stopped. He didn't stop. I have tried letting guest give him toys and treats which actually helped until the guest moved. If there is a change in the room he goes off again. As far as getting an already trained dog goes, I'd consider it if I didn't have Koda. I can't let Koda just go to any home. It has to be the right home. I'm worried about him biting somebody and being put down though. He isn't aggressive with my husband, daughter or I. It's just the rest of the world. He does take commands from strange woman though. He also will allow them to walk him. Just not touch him, or speak to him. I have a one and 2 year old neglected foster children coming to stay with me for two weeks in march and I really don't know what I'm going to do. I'm afraid he'll end up in his crate the whole time. The children don't understand language so I can't even figure out how I can teach them to be calm around him.
Is a dogs life worth my own? I wish I knew.
m8r5k
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My light at the end of the tunnel

Post by m8r5k »

I forgot about victoria being a mommy. Koda probably wouldn't be a good match for her then. Even she can't fix a dog over night. javascript:emoticon(':)')Just as I was about to give up, I think I may have found help. There is a lady who trains shelter dogs and she wants to help Koda before he becomes another shelter dog. I'm going to hope she can help. I really am on the verge of desperation here. I don't want my dog to die because I failed him. I've been in a panic lately trying to get to the bottom of this. If he bites my daughter I won't be able to make excuses for him anymore.
I think this has changed from a general discussion post to a training post. I am always open to new ideas. Any training advice can be sent to me in my email. I think I've tried just about everything. The funny thing is through all of this, I have learned so much I can fix other peoples dog problems. Just not my own. I have already worked with several people on training there dogs. I trained my sisters German shepherd, as well as diagnosing his ear infection. I also trained two 2 destructive labs and a lhasa apso. As well as giving a ton of advice that proved to be helpful.
Koda certainly has changed my life.
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Mattie
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Re: Help for my Koda

Post by Mattie »

m8r5k wrote:I've talked to so many trainers as well as spending hours online. I just feel like I'm running out of time. I know that fearful dogs become aggressive if not treated soon enough.
No wonder you feel desperate, so many different ideas, some you try others you don't and get more and more confused, you are not alone, there are many like you and thankfully some end up on here asking for advice.

I think Koda is making the transition. He just doesn't trust strangers. After an entire year of hard work I can walk him around outside, but if there is a child or someone speaks to him or tries to touch him he backs up and starts barking. Lately he is backing off less, and moving forward more often. Not in a good way. The employees at petco can give him a treat while he is calm (tossing it). When the treat is gone he goes nuts with the barking again.
Stop forcing him to meet people, as you are finding out this isn't helping, keep people away from him unless he wants to approach them. Don't let anyone approach him, especially children, if you push him too hard he will eventually bite someone.

I am frightened of balloons, I can stay at the oposite end of the room with them but if someone thinks it is fully and tries to force them onto me I panic, forcing him to meet people will have a similar effect on him.

Have a look a the body language clips that are on here somewhere, they will help you understand your dog better and be able to read what he is telling you. This is important with a nervous dog.

If I have company over he barks the entire time. I once had my mother over and he barked 3 hours strait. I have tried sending him to my room for time outs. He saw this as a relief, not a punishment, and didn't sop barking anyway. I have also tried hooking him to a leash in the living room and only removing him when he stopped. He didn't stop. I have tried letting guest give him toys and treats which actually helped until the guest moved. If there is a change in the room he goes off again.
He needs a safe place to go when people come, is he crate trained? Crates can become their safe haven, especially if they are covered with the door facing away from the room. Sometimes dogs also need this in another room. I know one dog who has her crate in the kitchen, when people come she goes in her crate, which is covered, people are in and out of the kitchen but she feels safe and sleeps. Before they started this she was like Koda. One day someone who was at this house a lot came into the kitchen and she came out of her crate, had a good look at him them went back in. Now she is fine with this man but still has issues with other people but getting better.

As far as getting an already trained dog goes, I'd consider it if I didn't have Koda. I can't let Koda just go to any home. It has to be the right home. I'm worried about him biting somebody and being put down though. He isn't aggressive with my husband, daughter or I. It's just the rest of the world. He does take commands from strange woman though. He also will allow them to walk him. Just not touch him, or speak to him. I have a one and 2 year old neglected foster children coming to stay with me for two weeks in march and I really don't know what I'm going to do. I'm afraid he'll end up in his crate the whole time. The children don't understand language so I can't even figure out how I can teach them to be calm around him.
So he is crate trained, that will make it easier, how is he with his crate?

I have 3 sons when they were small they were not allowed to go near my dog when my dog was in her bed, that was her safe haven. I would put his crate in a room where these children can't get to easily, possibly have a baby gate across the door so they can't get into the room. Once these children are asleep, you can have quality time with Koda.

During the day my time belonged to my children apart from walks and feeding, once my children were in bed, about 7pm, my time was my dog's and he would sit on my knee all evening being stroked and cuddled. He was happy with this, he still had his needs met. If during the day he needed a quick cuddle he got it.

With dogs with problems, you need to managed them as well as train them, with good management they learn that the world isn't such a scary place and do start to build up confidence. Another way to build his confidence up is with clicker training, this really does help nervous dogs.

Your dog is lucky to have a mum who is trying to put his needs before her's. :D
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ckranz
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Post by ckranz »

Please believe me when I say that you are not alone in having a dog dealing with severe fear and anxiety issue. Rehab is work and changes do not occur overnight. They take time patience and lots of love. I have my own "project dog" Khan" who I have spent 2.5 years and the hard work has paid off. Its been worth every hour of training, and dollar spent.

One thing to note though about shelters, even "NO Kill Shelters". That No Kill only applies to dogs they consider adoptable. THey have a behavioral assessment for each dog they intake to determine if the dog is adoptable, both behaviorally and medically. If your dog is as fearful as mine was when I started, I doubt he would pass. I was told flat out that Khan would fail and be put down if he ever came into a shelter.

The most important thing you can do to start off is learn to observe your dog and his surroundings. Become hyper aware of his triggers, his postures and the signs of building stress. YOu need to read your dog as well as he reads you. Take a good week or so.

Second, Do not let strangers interact with him. It is very clear that this is upsetting him and forcing him will only reduce his trust in you. He needs to see you as his protector.

Work heavily (in a non-stimulating environment) on basic obedience. If you can get access to some agility equipment or field, work on introducing different obstacles (work with a trainer privately). The obstacles and obedience work will serve to increase his bond and trust in you as well as help him to gain a bit more self confidence.

There are several books by Patricia McConnell covering the art and science of counter conditioning. Read it, live it breathe it. For a fearful dog there is no better tool.

To show you how far a dog can come:
Khan...a dog who was afraid of his own shadow, would bark a stuffed dogs used to help trainers learn to properly fit harnesses, would bark at random strangers and circle children menacingly, who failed even a basic temperment test. That was the dog we started with.

Khan today is a very confident and his confidence is still growing. He has found 2 sports he loves: agility and lure coursing. He is able to now wait his turn in line in agility. Last weekend he allow strangers to handle him at a luring event so I could be free to take pictures. While he did not pass CGC, he failed because he's become "too friendly" wanting to willing walk up and greet strangers in a crowd.

This forum is full of lots of very good advice and training techniques. I have not read about any methods I have not, nor would not use with my own dogs. A few of us may disagree on how to approach a problem, but our methods are all sound.
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Mattie
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Post by Mattie »

ckranz wrote: One thing to note though about shelters, even "NO Kill Shelters". That No Kill only applies to dogs they consider adoptable. THey have a behavioral assessment for each dog they intake to determine if the dog is adoptable, both behaviorally and medically. If your dog is as fearful as mine was when I started, I doubt he would pass. I was told flat out that Khan would fail and be put down if he ever came into a shelter.

One of the better known rescues in the UK has just put several dogs down that they have from RDR, thes dogs had been handled by volunteers and transported over 200 miles by these volunteers to this rescue. We have feedback which every volunteer who handles the dogs give, all their feedbacks was really good.

One dog, a Rottie, had a flea alergy, again was handled by our volunteers who all fell in love with him and his gentle nature, he was pts because of this alergy, the others were all given very feable excuses for. As we so many volunteers didn't have a lot of experience at first were able to handle these dogs without any problems, the rescue is lying.

What we have found out is they have a post Christmas clear out of dogs every year, it seems these dogs were in this clear out. :cry: For a rescue who claims they don't pts any healthy dogs and are given many thousands of pounds in donations because of this, they are now going to loose a lot of these donation because our volunteers always donate to rescues who take our dogs.

Needless to say they won't get any more of our dogs.
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Fundog
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Post by Fundog »

This quote was taken from the Best Friends Animal Sanctuary website (www.bestfriends.org):

"A few, who are too old or too sick, or who have suffered extra trauma, find a home and haven at the sanctuary, and are given loving care for the rest of their lives. "

While it's true that they could lie, and perhaps some shelters do, I feel inclined to believe Best Friends. Please visit their website; their facility is HUGE.

And I'm not posting this just to talk the original poster into giving up her Koda; by all means, if there is any way for you be able to keep him after all, that is great! But I don't want to discourage and frighten the OP, or anyone else, unnecessarily, either. I really don't think Best Friends stoops to the heinous acts that have been described of other shelters.
ckranz
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Post by ckranz »

Best friends is one of the few places which do not. Even highly aggressive dogs they are allowed to live. Best Friends though also does not accept every dog they are asked about. Many times due to space, logistics or other some such. They are a wonderful organization and if you are looking for an animal place to donate and excellent choice.

For those who would love to own a dog, but cannot for any number of reasons, you can become a guardian angel to some of the more severe medical cases that they have. Your donations and care are directed to a specific dog they have at their shelter. It really a neat program.
m8r5k
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Thank you

Post by m8r5k »

A trainer who helps people with my income, or lack of income, is going to be here in about 15 minutes. I walked Koda really good, and gave him some calming stuff. Everyone cross your fingers. Thank you everybody for your advice.
Koda is comfortable in his crate, but is becoming possessive over it. Last night I was laying on the floor beside it. I had my foot near the door. He growled and snapped at it. He has never shown aggression at me. I'm going to talk to the trainer about it, and see if she knows why the sudden change.
Koda is neutered and has been since he was about 5 months old. His crate is in the living room near his food and water dishes. He is not showing in food or toy aggression.
Is a dogs life worth my own? I wish I knew.
ckranz
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Post by ckranz »

Something I would check out with this dog would be a complete physical. Have a thyroid panel done. You may also want to consult with a canine chiropractor.

Sudden changes in temperment can be the result of hidden injury and pain.

Medical problems cannot be correct through behavior modification.
m8r5k
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Update

Post by m8r5k »

We have wanted to take Koda to see a veterinarian, but they can't do much with a dog that won't let people touch him.
Today a really great lady came to my house, and made huge progress with Koda in just an hour. We both cried when Koda actually allowed her to hug him and give him snuggles. He even gave her a little kiss on the chin. Besides the three people living in my home, Koda has not been touched by anyone, let alone snuggles, in over a year. She said Koda is definitely not aggressive, he just needs to learn how to be a dog and follow dog rules. She pointed out something I had never noticed also. Koda doesn't smell people. She sat next to his crate when she first arrived at my house and was waiting for koda to sniff her. It took him a long time to finally put his nose to the crate door and sniff. Now it seems like everything is new to him. I walked him through the store today and he actually was smelling peoples legs and feet, when we paused near someone. She also showed me how to you use touch instead of words to interact with him. I always give commands to him and never touch him when he is acting wrong. She did say he would be put down at the shelter though. She said she used to volunteer and once they put a 10 week old puppy down because they said it was too aggressive. When she tried to stand up for the animals she was dismissed from volunteering. I'm so glad there are people out there like her to help people like me. There have been so many smiles, laughs, and hugs in our house today. It feels so good to finally be able to relax after all this time. To see my dog transform before my eyes in only one hour. Who knows. Maybe tomorrow I can open my curtains and let some sun light in.
ckranz
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Post by ckranz »

Don't get me wrong, I am a huge advocate for animals, but in the US when you look at the enormormity of the overpopulation problem its not hard to understand why even minor behavior issues and medical issues result in dogs of all ages being pts.

Most shelters operate on shoestring budgets and cannot afford specialists to come in and train dogs with minor issues. In a law suit happy society neither can they accept the liability of adopting out any dog showing any noticeable temperment problem.

Likewise medical issues are hard to find willing adopters to take on the added expenses. Shelters also have limited space. The primary goal of the shelters in my area are to ensure that all dogs going out are healthy and behaviorally sound. They do have some capacity for dogs with very very minor issues, but my town has perhaps more money than most to donate to our local Humane Society SCPA. Their behaviorists also work with the local county shelter which shares a campus.

Dogs with issues like yours and one of mine are very very time consuming and hard work. It really takes a special person to dedicate the time and energy for a dog who has issues, especially when there are more out there looking for homes. It really take commitment.

As far as the vet check up. Until he is able to be touched I would muzzle him going to the vet. Againg getting him checked for any hidden injury and a thyroid panel needs to be done to rule out any potential medical reasons for his behavior. If he has a medical condition, until that condition is addressed, training may not be as effective or take much longer to overcome some issues. Its hard to be nice when you are in pain.

Pick up a copy of "On Talking Terms with Dogs: Calming Signals" by Turid Rugaas. The book will give you a better understanding of reading canine body language.

Another tool which will help you...Keep a training diary. In it cover the exercises you did, how your dog performed. Your insights into what is working and what isn't, your observations, your mood etc... If you start one now, and look back at it 6mo from now you will be amazed. With Khan there were times when I felt progress was non-existent. I would look at my training logs for the past 6months and be astounded how far we had come.

In most cases I was trying to move too quickly, each time I slowed done Khan's ability to cope with stressors showed marked changes. Working with troubled dogs is an extreme amount of work and commitment. It can also be costly. I personally have found the work as exhausting and frustrating as it has been to be among the most rewarding and fullfilling work one can do. I celebrate every achievement with Khan...like the first time he ran in an agility trial. OUr run was nothing to speak of, but he had a lot of fun. He did not bark or lunge at anyone and spent a good minutes zipping through lots of tunnels (It was a tunnler's event) and came back when I called him. I about cried with joy on how he behaved. It was one of my proudest moments with Khan and something I will always treasure.

The road is long and we are still working. Now that we can face our challenges with confidence, now he's learning about running with me as a team. Again progress is slow, but we have progress. I celebrate each step. In our last class we ran a very nice 6 obstacle sequence and he stayed with me instead of running off as he usually had done after the 3rd obstacle. It's those lightbulb moments to celebrate.

Another celebration was Khan was asked to leave 3 different training classes, including one class specificallyf or shy and fearful dogs. After several months of private training and evaluation we finally went through another class and made it through being able to participate in most of the work. (Though we still had to sit with some distance between us and the rest of the class). Our agility classes now Khan is able to wait in line with me like everyone else. Its almost like having a "normal" dog.

I know his potential when he gets afraid and I have to always keep that in mind, but I can relax more now with him as I know his confidence in himself and his confidence in me his handler has helped him tremendously.
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