Dog park incident-Advice wanted

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i_are_chanel
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:27 am

Dog park incident-Advice wanted

Post by i_are_chanel »

My dog Charlie is 7, going on 8, months old. I have been taking him to the dog park since he first had his shots, because I know how important it is to socialize your dog. He is a long haired chiuhuahua + dauchsand + papillion mix. He's about 10 lbs. My other dog is a golden retriever black lab mix, so he has never been afraid of other dogs at the dog park... But after reading the "Second fear factor" in this post, I am afraid that the incident that happend at the dog park yesterday may have more affect on him...

Incident :
First, I want to say that because he is so small some bigger dogs seem to be like, "Oh my god! What IS that? Is...Is that A DOG?" And they get way excited I believe because a lot of bigger dogs don't get socialized with smaller dogs. 98% of the time they don't hurt him. Dogs are very smart and most realize how big they are. Charlie loves to run with the big dogs, and learned quickly how to get out of the way of their feet. He's been accidently stepped on only a few times, Mostly by Lexi (my other dog) when we first got him
Yesterday, we were at the park and it was getting close to dinner so most people were leaving. Lexi really needs to excercise, so dogs or no, I try to stay over an hour with her at the park. Or else she is unbearable at home. Well, this new dog came in the gate and when he got let off his leash, he immediately went after Charlie. He chased him....Charlie got trampled....and since I've seen this happen a time or two before it usually ends up with him yelping, the dog going "Oh no! I'm sorry! Are you okay??" Because it is usually an accident.... They are running and he happens to be slower because his legs are shorter. But this dog just kept after him. His owner, a young female, did not try as hard as she could have to control her dog. Not only that, but he was clearly not listening to her calls. After a few more tramples and rolls in the dirt (and me screaming at the chick to make her dog stop it ) Charlie made it under a bench and the owner put her hand up (like a stop motion) said, "Hey! You're okay!" (She had this snotty tone that made me think that Charlie was over-reacting to her dog's actions) She then Turns around to approach her dog. He maintained his distance, as she walked and tried to get him to come to her (which took a few mins). I picked up Charlie and held him tight. He was shaking violently. He was so scared. I sat on the bench with him and tried to calm him down with my voice. I was not about to leave, even after the incident. (and knowing Lexi hadn't run out all her energy) and ESPECIALLY since the owner neither looked at me nor apologized to me for what her dog did to Charlie. My animal instincts/motherly instincts had kicked in, and although I wanted to scream at her, I just stood up, making it apparent I was NOT about to leave. (I was there first. How DARE she think I should leave after her dog behaved so forcefully). A few minutes later, she did leave with her dog. I put him down and made him walk to make sure he was unharmed, which thankfully, he was unmaimed. But he immediately stood on his hind legs and scratched my legs to tell me he wanted me to hold him. Charlie did not want to get out of my arms for at least 30 minutes after that. And he was not even going to LET the boxer that came in approach him, and was NOT going to let the boxer smell him. Period. He barked at the boxer when he tried to jump on me and look at what I was holding, and Charlie barked a bark I have not heard him do before.....it was a fearful bark. Usually he barks from excitement, "Oh! OH MY GOSH! A DOG! A DOG! LOOK A DOG." But this bark was a "Get the hell away from me now" bark. Then, the owner and the dog that had chased and trampled him came back. Charlie went nuts. I could tell he was cursing that dog for scaring him so badly earlier. And the other people at the dog park whom I had told about the incident all were like "Wow...He knows who did it." And he did.
After the incident, he didn't want to get down from my arms. I eventually could get him to walk about 6 feet from me before we left, but the second a bigger dog would come near him he was darting towards me and scratching at my legs, telling me to pick him up.
Because he is in the 6-9 month old range, I am afraid this will make him afraid of other big dogs, which he never was before.....(I read a post about how dogs' second fear installment is between the 6-9 month range...the first is 8-10 weeks....and incidents that happen in these time frames can permanently affect the dog) The rest of the time I was there I would reassure him none of the dogs were going to hurt him.....and of course none of them did.
Is there any thing I can do to make sure he is not permanently and negatively affected by this??? Did I handle the situation okay? Or should I have taken him home??
Lexi-3/4 golden retriever + 1/4 black lab. Bday Dec 1st 2007.

Charlie-long haired chihuahua + dauchsand + papillion. Bday Feb 29th 2008.
Mollysmom
Posts: 317
Joined: Thu Jul 24, 2008 9:24 pm
Location: Walla Walla, WA, USA

Post by Mollysmom »

doesn't your park have a "small dog" area separate from the larger area?
I'd advise taking him back often, as positive experiences will outweigh the negative. Since your chi is still very young most dogs are likely to still give him puppy license. like with a young child if you over "coddle" him or avoid the park he'll be more likely to associate what happened with something "bad" whereas if you act as if nothing happened and "get back in the saddle" he wont.
Dogs live in the now, if you focus too much on what has happened he'll get neurotic...
Next time you're at the park and you notice your chi getting harrassed overly by a bigger dog, step in but DO NOT pick him up. Just stand between your dog and the other. Remember that it might be your dog causing trouble (even my "perfect angel" starts problems at the dog park :roll: ) dont let yourself get anxious if it's possilbe.
Remember that with small dogs, picking them up has the same effect as leashing them in dog parks, and will cause more fights than leaving them down.
~* Proud Mommy of a Mix Breed *~
[url=http://www.myspace.com/mollymae2004]Molly's Myspace Page[/url]
"If your dog doesn't like someone you probably shouldn't either." - Unknown
ckranz
Posts: 1028
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:18 pm
Location: San Diego CA

Post by ckranz »

The pros an cons of off-leash dog parks.

Dog parks can be your best friend, but they can just as easily be your worst nightmare. All of this depends on the people that use the park. If everyone say on this forum showed up at the same time at the same dog park, it would be a wonderful place.

This is not to say there may not be incidents between individual dogs, but that as owners as a group we are far more observant of our dogs behaviors and quicker to step in before a problem occurs.

More than half of the people that go to dog parks have no clue in understanding their dog's, (Too many people watching National Geographic if you get my meaning) let alone any other dogs behavior.

This can lead to situations like yours.

Understanding this means it is crucial that while at the park you protect your dog. This means if there is a smaller area for small dogs and you have a small dog, using it. Tiny dog can easily be injured by large dogs just in play. Even if you have a small dog at home with your large dog, not every large dog understands the frailty of tiny dogs.

In order to better protect your dog at the park and ensure that he has a good time, you need to be able to assess his level of stress quickly. A new dog coming into the park, do your dog's ears perk up, does he fix a stare at the gate? These may indicate stress from uncertainty about the incoming dog.

Most dogs when arriving at the park want to zip in and run right up to the first dogs they see at the park. For a tiny dog this can be pretty frightening as a larger dog approaches at high speed all excited about being at the park. The excited entrant is not likely to initially be polite in his excitement (and of course that is something you cannot control).

What you can do is get your dog's attention. PUt your body between the oncoming dog and your dog which will force the oncoming dog to approach at a curve and perhaps slow down. This should help your little one a bit in identifying the incoming dog as not being a threat.

Look and identify potential problems before they occur and you can prevent many bad interactions from escalating or even beginning.

Second before allowing your tiny dog to engage in play, take some time to observe and know the dog he is engaged with. I would not let him engage dogs that you do not know, both the dog and the owner. Perhaps setting up times to meet regular people at your park (kind of a play group).

If at anytime, you feel uncomforatble about any dog in the park, leave. This is not a matter of rights and wrongs, but a matter of saftey and comfort which in my book trumps rights and priveledge any time.

Exercise comes both in terms of physical and mental exercise. Check out the mental exercise thread under methods for games to play that can be more exhausting for your dog than a good run.

While dog parks are place of lots of activity with dogs and people, they are not the ideal place for socialization. This is because the dogs are off leash and thus less controlled. What I did with my dogs was to go the parking lots of my nearest big box pet outlet and walk my dog around their. We rewarded any looks and such to other dogs and cats and people, practiced leash walking and other such trianing. Training was done in and out of the store.

Another area we trained was our vet's office. We'd go in, I put down his blanket and we would settle in the office for about 10 minutes and then leave. There was a good flow of people and dogs going in and out. (I did ok this with my vet). This has the added benefit of your dog enjoying going to your vet's office which is really cool.

Enroll in puppy classes or dog training classes, again you meet puppies and dogs in a more controlled environment than in a dog park.
MaiasMom
Posts: 429
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:02 pm
Location: Everett, Washington

Bad experience at the dog park

Post by MaiasMom »

I can't tell you how many times I have seen this same thing. To be honest with you, my 2 yr old male has done this. He is not agressive by nature, just loves to chase with other dogs. I am one that will keep my eye on him and if he even looks like he is going to try to "motivate" a small or shy dog" to run will immedately call him back and put him on his leash until he calms down, he is a working dog. It is in his nature. That woman needs some training herself.

If it were me, I would say that you need to go back and start your small dogs social training over again, this time if you can find a park that has a small and shy dog area. Perhaps starting over with one large CALM dog and add more as this puppy becomes more confident.

Unfortunately, not all dog owners are responsible owners and yes you have every right to be there. Does your park have some one in charge that you can bring this issue to. Some one that can approach this woman to give her the heads up on what the rules are?

I am sorry this happened to your little dog and I think it can be reversed with time, training and patience. The big thing is to not re-enforce his fear. That is going to be hard because Mom's want to comfort.

I hope this helps you.
The best days are spent with my dogs.
i_are_chanel
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:27 am

Post by i_are_chanel »

we were at the dog park today. Charlie has been fine ever since the incident....expect today....Brady (the dog that went after him) showed up. He wouldnt stop barking. Every time Brady was in view of Charlie, Charlie was barking hysterically (im sure he was cursing at Brady).
Another owner was asking me if Charlie was always that anxious. I said no, there was a dog here that trampled him a week or so ago. He was quiet, and then as Brady walked by, so says, "Oh. Was it Brady?" I looked at her and thought....oh my god....and said "yep." She looked at Brady looked at me, and said, "Yeah...well Brady isn't a very nice dog."

THe rules of the dog park specifically state you are not supposed to bring mean or agressive dogs to the dog park. I was watching Brady while I was there and he is NOT a well trained dog. Period. Is there anything I can do to keep this lady from bringing her dog to the park where he could be a liability to other Pet owners??

Also, Did I mention when the owner saw Charlie's reaction to Brady, she laughed......
Lexi-3/4 golden retriever + 1/4 black lab. Bday Dec 1st 2007.

Charlie-long haired chihuahua + dauchsand + papillion. Bday Feb 29th 2008.
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