Vent!

[bendog]

Hopefully just overexcited barking and yapping not full blown rumbling snarls

Yes definately just over excited! It's the same bark he does when he gets out the car, or out the front door for a walk.
Most owners just laugh at him.

[Nettle]

I so agree that 'be nice' is code for 'my dog eats other dogs'.

I have to be so careful of my mouth

A while back I was walking my dogs when I saw a woman (12 stone ish - that's 12x14 pounds) being dragged towards us by her large hackled-up staring dog. Despite my moving a good distance away, they kept on after us.

"He's playing" she gasped.

"I'd hate to see him when he's serious" I said bitterly.

[JudyN]

That's like my window cleaner, when we met him with his white boxer *****, lunging at Jasper and straining at her leash, snarling and foaming at the mouth, eyes bulging, as he said 'They'd love to play off lead together, wouldn't they?'

I confess to having said 'He's usually OK' on occasion - though only when he's met a dog I'm pretty darn sure he won't get snarky with, or restrict it to a brief 'Bog off, I don't want to play.' He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt so much these days, though.

[katej215]

so guys ..i'd be interested to hear what you think..am i being an unreasonable nark...?

Most of the time these days I can manage Hattie's interactions with other dogs, recall isn't bad, plus i use a load of other distraction tactics if necessary..however sometimes she will go bombing over to another off lead dog -and there's sod all i can do get her to change course...Hattie is a lovely mannered girl, and it seems her main reason for going over to other dogs is to initiate a game of chase..

so this happened again today - she ran over to a border collie, and they were both having a very even handed game of chase ..the owner of the collie was standing watching as I was, but i was quite a distance away. I waited for a couple of opportune moments to call Hats back..nothing ..(she was having a ball). So the collie owner was standing there and standing there - and I'm thinking collie owner just turn away and carry on with your walk - as I know for sure there will be a point where Hattie will think -too far from Mum and come back to me..but no - the collie owner then starts walking towards me and flapping his arms at Hattie obviously trying to signal to her to go back to me.. I know that if I go over there it'll just prolong the game of chase even further ..Anyway whilst I was shouting -' it's fine she'll come back to me, just carry on' -she came flying back..

Why do people feel they need to take responsibility for my dog?? If i didn't like the look of the chase game, or if i thought she'd run off i'd be there like a shot. I know my dog - she's a fox terrier and there is a element of i'll do it when i'm ready ! but i have no doubt in my mind that she wont ever get really far away without checking herself and coming back -and she certainly wouldn't run off - so going over to her, trying to catch her , just turns something very simple into a big hoohaa...I know people are trying to help, and appreciate it from the other side, if there on their walk and there's a pesky little terrier running in circles around them...but still if they just kept their focus on their own dog...

[rachel540]

Oh-oh i better keep my mouth shut, i warn Pepper to be steady as she approaches people and dogs, not because shes not going to react correctly but because her run up is so fast i have to remind her to slow down

Kate i think when dogs meet dogs their owners dont talk to each other enough, we're not mind readers so dont know when theyve had enough - the dog or the owner. So i have learnt to talk first and shout over if necessary. In hindsight you could have said that earlier but dont worry about

[Nettle]

Kate - you know your own dog, but other people (may) know theirs, and they might be trying to stop an interaction because their dog is about to do something

[gwd]

Kate - you know your own dog, but other people (may) know theirs, and they might be trying to stop an interaction because their dog is about to do something

THIS^^^^

my dogs are both live and let live.......and i'd say they're not particularly social. they really don't have any desire to play with other dogs. they have no issue with another dog meandering by and doing a quick social sniff......and then moving on, but a dog running up fast and trying to start a game is not something they're interested in.

it's not just the two i have now, it's pretty much been the same with every dog i've owned. .....and that's a LOT of dogs.

i often wonder if it's part of the spayed/neutered vs entire thing.

my dogs don't play with strange dogs. they don't mind if another dog wants to tag along with their sniffing adventure, they don't mind if another dog wants to go check a promising bush for bunnies, or even if we're walking and other dogs want to join in on the adventure of a group pilgrimage, but my adult dogs simply don't play with dogs they've just met.

they seem to lose the wish to do that sort of thing around the time they hit sexual maturity.

this is just my observation, but it seems that adult dogs that want to start fun zoomie games with strange dogs are generally altered.

so, what say you? do your adult entires still want to run up to new dogs and start a zoomie game routinely?

[lucyandbella]

i often wonder if it's part of the spayed/neutered vs entire thing.

I don’t think it’s an altered unaltered thing. All female dogs in my family are rescued so by law were spayed juvenilely (at the age of four months) and none of them would ever start a game with an unknown dog though they will start a chase game with each other. Lucy is perfectly happy passing dogs or a quick sniff and then moving on but she gets quite snarky to dogs that nag us on our walks and will occasionally turn and growl at dogs that try to follow us (and then the other owner complains that my dog is aggressive ). My sister’s unaltered male on the other hand would like nothing more than to play with every dog he meets, though he is very biddable and has yet to run off to do so as long as my sister is there. Maybe it has more to do with breed and personality.

Sometimes I do feel it’s my responsibility to get the other dog to go away if I can read that my dogs are uncomfortable (actually the continuing following us as we walk away is what sets otherwise friendly Lucy off on a dog sometimes). My mom’s young altered female also can be off leash without running off to meet other dogs and if one comes up to us she doesn’t mind but doesn’t start playing either (in fact pushy dogs that bark and nip to start play actually make her nervous and at that point I either tell the owner my dog is nervous or I leave). In fact the only dogs mine chose to play with are dogs that we have known for a long time and that they have met numerous times. And still most of the time when a friends dog is over they don’t interact at all after the initial greeting. I find my dogs most often get upset when the dog runs full steam at them and meets them face to face, both friendly girls become quite nervous of this and I try to stop the approaching dog before it gets to me.

As a reactive dog owner I feel like I also get the blame when my dog (under my control) almost goes off on Fluffy who ran up to us as the owner didn’t care or couldn’t get the dog back. I have to work to keep myself between my dog and the uninvited dog at the same time I am trying to distract Bella and keep her calm, not an easy task. Most say I should keep her muzzled or not take her where other dogs may be (note I only walk her in areas where leash laws exist yet nobody, including myself at times, listens to them. And I would never walk her at a dog beach or some other area like that). I feel that my dogs world must become ever smaller because other “friendly” dogs have the right to charge up to my aggressive dog. It’s not fair, she is fine with dogs as long as there is no forced interaction, we can pass dogs without her reacting at all. Even if muzzled (I do muzzle in some areas) she would still become very stressed and try to attack an unknown dog who tried to interact with her. She can interact with dogs but they must be introduced slowly and in a certain way.

I get that sometimes our dog’s don’t listen, but I feel you should always ask before you let your dog approach another dog and work on recall for dogs that just run fast up to another dog. I like what rachel has taught her dog, approaching slowly and calmly makes a world of difference.

[minkee]

Scout is definitely a zoomie-pup if she doesn't have alternate entertainment (ie. her ball). She was neutered at 6 months and is now 3.

It could well be, also, that the guy with the collie - his dog may have not followed him and preferred to stay with the exciting fun-dog if he had walked off, you never know

[katej215]

Kate i think when dogs meet dogs their owners dont talk to each other enough, we're not mind readers so dont know when theyve had enough

Kate - you know your own dog, but other people (may) know theirs, and they might be trying to stop an interaction because their dog is about to do something

Fair points. I guess I think i'm reading the interaction correctly - ie both dogs are at ease -but i dont know the other dog and i'm no behaviourist! I guess it is probably my responsibility to go over regardless of whether i feel the interaction is safe ..even if its just to say, yes do walk off my dog will come back to me (honest!)

i often wonder if it's part of the spayed/neutered vs entire thing.

My dog is not spayed, but at 17 months still quite puppyish. I've noticed though she does seem to be getting less and less interested in other dogs

I feel that my dogs world must become ever smaller because other “friendly” dogs have the right to charge up to my aggressive dog. It’s not fair, she is fine with dogs as long as there is no forced interaction

totally hear what you are saying, and cannot believe the number of owners that dont take a blind bit of notice of their dogs running up to mine when mine is on the lead. She is not reactive in the slightest but they dont know that.

[Wes]

Now I remember why I never look at dog training threads unless they're here! I frequent a beardie forum and a poster inquired advice on her two rescued, female, 1.5 year old dogs not getting on. The most common advice was pack reduction, NILIF, shock collars , and a whole bunch of nonsense about correcting. God forbid I mention management, vet checks, and inquiring over here. Got ripped a new one. Most enjoyed deriding Victoria Stilwell (even though I stated she extremely rarely gives advice here) and being too soft on the dogs. I said nothing further, unsubscribed to the thread, and sent the OP a PM encouraging her to at least LOOK here.

Best quote? "I find two bitches are often the best choice for a house, particularly sisters."

[OnceInAWeil]

^Ugh, that's terrible, Wes. The (dobie!) rescue I volunteer at has another trainer there who is very good in some ways, but still subscribes to some older schools of thought...we just had a volunteer post on the rescue forum about her two resident dogs having conflict, and the other trainer suggested things like pack leadership and poking in the ribs. I feel it would be rude to say anything contrary publicly, so I PMed the volunteer about her issue. I hope she listens about not using physical corrections.

[Wes]

^Ugh, that's terrible, Wes. The (dobie!) rescue I volunteer at has another trainer there who is very good in some ways, but still subscribes to some older schools of thought...we just had a volunteer post on the rescue forum about her two resident dogs having conflict, and the other trainer suggested things like pack leadership and poking in the ribs. I feel it would be rude to say anything contrary publicly, so I PMed the volunteer about her issue. I hope she listens about not using physical corrections.

In hindsight, I probably should have just kept my mouth shut and PMed her. What was funny was that the ringleader of the pack theory enthusiasts was advising someone on how to tame their new Argentinian tegu - and advising to go slow, go at the lizard's pace, don't force interaction, make sure you reward the behaviours you like, ignore those you don't, etc. I wanted to comment that they should be doing this with their dogs as well!

I hope your volunteer listens to you! Dobies are sensitive, and I know mine will do just about anything for praise and approval. I'd love to volunteer at DRU (the Doberman rescue somewhat near me), but the distance and the fact that they have prong collars on all their dogs makes me shy away. I don't think I could keep my mouth shut.

[Erica]

Emmy's been losing weight recently, though she used to be overweight, so I was checking on how to tell a cat's physical condition etc. That's not what this is about, though. I found a link to one of those animal body condition charts, except it was a defunct link to Purina. A popup window asked me to take a survey, so I did because why not. Did some pre-visit questions ("Would you consider feeding your animal Purina?" There was no option for "never," just "only under certain circumstances" or "I've heard of Purina but do not care to try their product" kind of things. :U ), then it asked me to finish the questions after visiting the site. I will note that before visiting the site I only put "somewhat disagree" after the statement "Purina understands the relationship with my dog" and something else; all others were "strongly disagree" to things like "We are experts in pet nutrition" and "We are innovators of pet diets." Anyways, what I found on their site was seriously disturbing. The link that caught my eye was "Why we're pro-grain, pro-corn, pro-nutrition!" so I checked it out. Eugh, just as awful as I suspected. BS all over, trying to con people into thinking corn is good for their carnivore. :/ They were spewing nonsense on how dog foods are more strictly regulated than human food - where the hell did they pull that from? My answers changed after the visit, from mostly negative to as strongly negative as they gave an option to be. Yuck yuck yuck.

[OnceInAWeil]

^Ugh, that's terrible, Wes. The (dobie!) rescue I volunteer at has another trainer there who is very good in some ways, but still subscribes to some older schools of thought...we just had a volunteer post on the rescue forum about her two resident dogs having conflict, and the other trainer suggested things like pack leadership and poking in the ribs. I feel it would be rude to say anything contrary publicly, so I PMed the volunteer about her issue. I hope she listens about not using physical corrections.

In hindsight, I probably should have just kept my mouth shut and PMed her. What was funny was that the ringleader of the pack theory enthusiasts was advising someone on how to tame their new Argentinian tegu - and advising to go slow, go at the lizard's pace, don't force interaction, make sure you reward the behaviours you like, ignore those you don't, etc. I wanted to comment that they should be doing this with their dogs as well!

I hope your volunteer listens to you! Dobies are sensitive, and I know mine will do just about anything for praise and approval. I'd love to volunteer at DRU (the Doberman rescue somewhat near me), but the distance and the fact that they have prong collars on all their dogs makes me shy away. I don't think I could keep my mouth shut.

I'm only being so diplomatic because I know these people in real life. If it were randoms on the internet, I'd have done the same as you.

My rescue did have one of our dogs in a prong once and I had a fit about it, though. There's only so much you can let slide, you know? So totally understand why you would avoid one that uses them as a standard. There is a new rottie rescue in my area, but their main trainer uses shock collars and the rescue thinks he's amazing, so I probably won't go down that road. It can get exhausting trying to explain the positive way when people have been into the aversive thing for a long time.